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How the “what’s your current salary?” question hurts the gender pay gap

washingtonpost.com

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Re: How the “what’s your current salary?” question hurts the gender pay gap

#11

Post by dbbk »

I don't understand this 'gender pay gap' concept at all. Whatever figure my compensation is is, to a large extent, quite arbitrary. Sure there's a general sense of what range I should expect my salary to be in, based on my experience/location/etc, but really the final figure comes down to whatever number gets thrown out and accepted in negotiation.

So if you poll half a workforce who are male, and poll half a workforce who are female, and discover that their pay doesn't line up... why would you be surprised?

Re: How the “what’s your current salary?” question hurts the gender pay gap

#12

Post by technocodes »

Chinjut wrote: post #8
patrickmay wrote: post #2

> Cornell professors Francine Blau and Lawrence Kahn found that women were paid 79 cents for each dollar a man was paid. Even after adjusting for type of job, industry, experience, location and education, the gap remained 92 cents for each dollar. This is not supported by the evidence. See, for example, this article by Christina Hoff Sommers ( http://time.com/3222543/5-feminist-myths-that-will-not-die/ ): "No matter…

Oh, ok. So, logically, it must just be that women-associated occupations tend to be lower payed than men, women tend to be slotted into lower positions than men, women aren't encouraged into or supported in higher education the same way as men, women do not receive job tenure as easily as men, and/or gendered pressures cause women to work less hours per week (on careers rather than, e.g., a disproportionate share of…

No it's like saying most investment bankers are male and make 500k a year, most nurses are female and make 70k a year, Injustice! Look at that pay gap! Outrageous!

- It makes zero sense.

EDIT: What I meant to say is men go into different careers than woman and for different reasons. Usually men go after higher paying jobs (investment banking). When people compute the pay gap they dont take this into account, so they compare pay across industries (investment banking to nursing) which is meaningless, and likely is propaganda.

Re: How the “what’s your current salary?” question hurts the gender pay gap

#13

Post by geofft »

patrickmay wrote: post #2

> Cornell professors Francine Blau and Lawrence Kahn found that women were paid 79 cents for each dollar a man was paid. Even after adjusting for type of job, industry, experience, location and education, the gap remained 92 cents for each dollar. This is not supported by the evidence. See, for example, this article by Christina Hoff Sommers ( http://time.com/3222543/5-feminist-myths-that-will-not-die/ ): "No matter…

That interpretation is misleading for a few reasons.

One is that "to the point of vanishing" is still very nonzero. There's a report by Consad Corporation prepared for the Department of Labor that reaches the figure 5-7% after accounting for differences in jobs (their website is down at the moment), even though it concludes that "there may be nothing to correct." That's also the number Sommers herself writes in her HuffPo article she cites in that Time article: "After controlling for several relevant factors (though some were left out, as we shall see), they found that the wage gap narrowed to only 6.6 cents." So the Cornell claim of 8% is basically the same. I don't think there's an argument to be made that a 23% gender pay gap is a scandal but a 5-8% gap is totally fine.

The other is that occupations, positions, education, job tenure, or hours worked is affected by existing wages. I was unemployed by choice for several months last year, learning Rust and working on a few open-source projects, and I became a more valuable job candidate as a result of that. I could not have done that without the savings to take those months off. If my previous job had paid me anywhere from 8% to 23% less, I would probably not have decided to take those months off, and in return I would have been a less competitive candidate and my job would probably have been one of lower position.

Re: How the “what’s your current salary?” question hurts the gender pay gap

#14

Post by serge2k »

patrickmay wrote: post #2

> Cornell professors Francine Blau and Lawrence Kahn found that women were paid 79 cents for each dollar a man was paid. Even after adjusting for type of job, industry, experience, location and education, the gap remained 92 cents for each dollar. This is not supported by the evidence. See, for example, this article by Christina Hoff Sommers ( http://time.com/3222543/5-feminist-myths-that-will-not-die/ ): "No matter…

They mention that explicity > after adjusting for type of job, industry, experience, location and education, the gap remained 92 cents for each dollar.

8% is still a lot.

I'd like for companies to just show the data.

Re: How the “what’s your current salary?” question hurts the gender pay gap

#15

Post by actionwords »

Chinjut wrote: post #8
patrickmay wrote: post #2

> Cornell professors Francine Blau and Lawrence Kahn found that women were paid 79 cents for each dollar a man was paid. Even after adjusting for type of job, industry, experience, location and education, the gap remained 92 cents for each dollar. This is not supported by the evidence. See, for example, this article by Christina Hoff Sommers ( http://time.com/3222543/5-feminist-myths-that-will-not-die/ ): "No matter…

Oh, ok. So, logically, it must just be that women-associated occupations tend to be lower payed than men, women tend to be slotted into lower positions than men, women aren't encouraged into or supported in higher education the same way as men, women do not receive job tenure as easily as men, and/or gendered pressures cause women to work less hours per week (on careers rather than, e.g., a disproportionate share of…

women aren't slotted into lower positions. they slot themselves into lower positions. how many women carpenters or welders or electricians or plumbers do you know? These are relatively high paying jobs. How many women do you know that studied gender studies? This 'field' of 'study' amounts to little more than indoctrination into an ideology and doesn't lead to the generation of future revenue.

Re: How the “what’s your current salary?” question hurts the gender pay gap

#16

Post by angelbob »

drcross wrote: post #4

>Study after study demonstrates that women are paid less than men in the United States. I wish some of these studies are cited because if you are telling me that I could hypothetically be able to hire someone who is able to do the same job, for less money (like the fabled 79%), I would gladly take them up on the offer. Unfortunately it doesn't exist except in delusional minds. This is the free market, not some global…

From the article: "Cornell professors Francine Blau and Lawrence Kahn found that..."

Here you go, I Googled that for you: http://inequality.stanford.edu/_media/pdf/key_issues/gender_...

Now, the study in question is cited.

Re: How the “what’s your current salary?” question hurts the gender pay gap

#18

Post by eli »

patrickmay wrote: post #2

> Cornell professors Francine Blau and Lawrence Kahn found that women were paid 79 cents for each dollar a man was paid. Even after adjusting for type of job, industry, experience, location and education, the gap remained 92 cents for each dollar. This is not supported by the evidence. See, for example, this article by Christina Hoff Sommers ( http://time.com/3222543/5-feminist-myths-that-will-not-die/ ): "No matter…

Resumes with male names are ranked higher than identical resumes with female names.

Re: How the “what’s your current salary?” question hurts the gender pay gap

#19

Post by mordocai »

Whatever your feelings on the existence (or not) of the "gender pay gap" the process the article describes seems perfectly fair. I think people are getting hung up on the gender part and not seeing the "fair pay" system they've apparently setup.
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