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Amazon Reports Surge in Profit

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Re: Amazon Reports Surge in Profit

#91
post #42

Why do people link to basic stories like this behind a paywall? If WSJ has an original piece out, fine, but this could've come from any one of a thousand sources. http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-04-28/amazon-sal...

So....block ad blockers and HN screams. "I will pay for content", they say. "I just don't like your 25MB flash ads." Link to crap, and HN screams. "Is journalism dead? This stuff is just click bait. I appreciate good writing and quality content." Put up a paywall and HN screams. "Why u make me pay?!?!?!?"

actually the problem is sharing content that is behind a paywall. nothing against putting that behind a paywal and i definitly would subscribe wsj if i would like their stories / has interests in the content they are posting. (however I don't like such stuff) I've read some articles of wsj that where accessible through google (pretty controversial). also mostly I watch hn and click on a link to read the comments first and then I know that I mostly could ignore certain links.

Re: Amazon Reports Surge in Profit

#92
post #41

Amazon's rationale for its lack of profits is well known... Why does this rationale not apply to its cloud business? Is the cloud business so good that it generates profits regardless of the investment it makes... or is the retail business so bad that it can't generate profits regardless of the investment AMZN makes in it?

Considering Amazon is able to constantly expand into new retail fields (like groceries), launch a cloud services business, launch own its internal logistics business (that is the 2nd largest provider in the UK now) says to me the Retail business is probably more profitable than the media would have us believe...

From speaking with internal Amazon employees, their total profit is negative because they invest more money into expansion than they are taking in. They make an incredible amount of money and likely would be turning a profit if not for the extensive investments. But as it stands, expenses (including expansion costs) outstrip revenue, thus profit is negative.

Re: Amazon Reports Surge in Profit

#93
post #42

Why do people link to basic stories like this behind a paywall? If WSJ has an original piece out, fine, but this could've come from any one of a thousand sources. http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-04-28/amazon-sal...

So....block ad blockers and HN screams. "I will pay for content", they say. "I just don't like your 25MB flash ads." Link to crap, and HN screams. "Is journalism dead? This stuff is just click bait. I appreciate good writing and quality content." Put up a paywall and HN screams. "Why u make me pay?!?!?!?"

The problem is the business model.

All of these behaviors 1) are hostile to high-quality accessble content and 2) are fundamentally driven by advertising (or its failure).

Information is a public good. This doesn't mean it costs nothing to produce (the contrary), but high-quality public information has a high positive externality to the common wealth (that is, the commonwealth), and is essential in a democratic society.

Some see the solution as micropayments. I disagree strongly, see Nick Szabo, Clay Shirky, and Hal Varian as to why not. Superbundling might work, but the ultimate superbundle is a highly aggregated, means-based fee. Either a direct tax (income or wealth-indexed) or bundled into broadband services. The former strikes me as more equitable, the latter as more viable.

The costs are low. A $100/year average fee per $30k in income, charged only among OECD nations, would cover all online advertising revenues. A $500/30k rate would cover the entire advertising industry. ($30k is chosen as roughly median OECD per capita income.)

(Note: corrected from earlier figures which applied to worldwide population: $20/person and $100/person would cover everything, if paid by everyone, though I see an argument for progressivity applying the tax to developed nations.)

The distortions, perverse incentives, inefficiencies, privacy invasions, security risks, and more, of the present model simply aren't worth it.

HN's policy is that paywall-based stories are acceptable. I disagree strongly with this view. The WSJ is trying to play both sides of the subscriber-only / viral content game. And are providing increasingly slanted, unreliable, Murdoch-tainted content to boot. I view it as barely above spam.

There are other sources, they should be allowed and encouraged. WSJ should be blacklisted.

And yes, I absolutely would like to see an alternative publication financing model pursued. I'm not holding my breath. But supporters of the model I've proposed include Richard M. Stallman of FSF and Phil Hunt of Pirate Party, UK, among others.

Previously, on global advertising spend, publishing models, and per-capita costs: https://plus.google.com/104092656004159577193/post /adKy4gM317c

Several posts on content syndication, and inherent problems of information goods and markets: https://www.reddit.com/r/dredmorbius/search?q=content+syndic...

Hal Varian (UC Berkeley economist, Google's chief economist) on information goods and markets: http://people.ischool.berkeley.edu/~hal/Papers/japan/index.h...

Re: Amazon Reports Surge in Profit

#94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So....block ad blockers and HN screams. "I will pay for content", they say. "I just don't like your 25MB flash ads." Link to crap, and HN screams. "Is journalism dead? This stuff is just click bait. I appreciate good writing and quality content." Put up a paywall and HN screams. "Why u make me pay?!?!?!?"

Solution: don't do shitty things (e.g. block ad-blockers, write awful content, or use paywalls). Easy.

To be fair, this doesn't address publishing's revenue problem, though it does the public good element. See my earlier comment.

Re: Amazon Reports Surge in Profit

#96
post #42

Why do people link to basic stories like this behind a paywall? If WSJ has an original piece out, fine, but this could've come from any one of a thousand sources. http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-04-28/amazon-sal...

I've submitted that as an alternate.

Vote that up and flag this if that's the way you feel: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11592904

(I'm well aware that HN doesn't condone flagging paywalled content. I disagree strongly with that stance, particularly as the paywall repeatedly becomes the primary topic of discussion.)

I'm also more than happy for you to be credited with the submission, though it didn't happen to be submitted already at the time I posted it (I strongly suspected it would have been).

Re: Amazon Reports Surge in Profit

#97
post #42

Why do people link to basic stories like this behind a paywall? If WSJ has an original piece out, fine, but this could've come from any one of a thousand sources. http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-04-28/amazon-sal...

I've submitted that as an alternate. Vote that up and flag this if that's the way you feel: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11592904 (I'm well aware that HN doesn't condone flagging paywalled content. I disagree strongly with that stance, particularly as the paywall repeatedly becomes the primary topic of discussion.) I'm also more than happy for you to be credited with the submission, though it didn't happen to…

> if that's the way you feel

Everyone who feels good about paywall articles, raise your hand.

crickets

Re: Amazon Reports Surge in Profit

#98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Jump on board, but don't wear the shackles! Use something like Kubernetes and FOSS projects and you can shift to whomever has the cheapest VMs today. Easier said than done, I know, but a fine goal to have, I'd say. :-)

I totally agree with you in the ideal case. Problem is in some ways, AWS is too awesome due to all the add-on services. Systems are more than just compute, and the last 3 companies I've worked for have become increasingly coupled to AWS over time due to use of the add-on services. You build your system and over time you need message queuing, ability to send emails, databases, load balancing... You can run / build the…

Apprenda does all of that, without relying on a company far larger than you

Re: Amazon Reports Surge in Profit

#99
post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The impression I've gotten from friends working there is the reverse: The cloud business is making so much money it can't spend it fast enough. The retail side, meanwhile, is making money but spending it faster enough to remain "not profitable"

That's not really how accounting works

It's how it works at Amazon.

"How much gross profit is the retail business going to generate that I can spend on drones and the Amazon Echo v2"

Re: Amazon Reports Surge in Profit

#100
post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There should eventually be some time when Amazon does finally cash out, presumably on some timeline as a function of Bezos's mortality. Its unrealistic to be around forever. How many companies last hundreds of years? How many tech companies last decades?

> How many tech companies last decades? Amazon is at 2 decades and going strong. Any reason to think they won't last a long time?

My prediction is AWS will split after Jeff dies (or is otherwise not involved in the company). Then Amazon retail will split from Amazon logistics, and so on.
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