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MakerBot Is Outsourcing Its Brooklyn Manufacturing Jobs to China

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Re: MakerBot Is Outsourcing Its Brooklyn Manufacturing Jobs to China

#91
post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It seems to be, at best, something you try and use as a value add to your real service like DB consulting.

Why not make your real service on-site repair? That's less outsourceable than consulting, even.

Who is going to pay for on-site repair for consumer 3d printers? Only a handful of businesses that actually rely on 3d printers use a MakerBot.

Re: MakerBot Is Outsourcing Its Brooklyn Manufacturing Jobs to China

#92
post #9

Caveat Emptor. If you can't fork you aren't free. The Makerbot rose up from a spirit of sharing and community goodwill, made money and employed local Brooklyites - so it was a flagship for the sharing economy and open hardware. Now there is an impression that they closed it off. Make4rbot was bought by the holder of a patent for the sintering 3D printing technology, seen as an impediment to this useful methods commun…

In a number of ways this echoes the early microcomputer industry (thinking the 1970s-80s), when dozens of competing and incompatible standards existed. Atari, Apple, Commodore, Amiga, just to name a few. And as the industry neared middle age in the 1990s, shopping for a "PC Clone" was a cornucopia of options: a copy of PC Shopper was hundreds of pages thick, each with ads for "custom made" PC clones "built to your sp…

Mature free markets that entail paper thin margins are naturally disrupted and conquered.

Jobs had seen Kay's Dynabook at Parc and had some vision of what portable computers could offer. Apple phones made $250 per phone, even with less than 0.5% of the market Jobs had already won as Nokia et al. made ~pence per phone.

Cartels and Monopolies naturally aggregate to protect incumbents from the needs & desires of the customer and society from the painful costs of over rapid progress, yet like great empires companies decline when their owners lose touch with their daily customers needs, demands or desires.

Intellectual property rights are not natural rights but a social contract, providing temporary monopoly in exchange for social benefit.

Rinse and repeat.

Re: MakerBot Is Outsourcing Its Brooklyn Manufacturing Jobs to China

#94

A lot of people wonder why large companies can't just stay in the US and compete on quality, and here is a great case for why. It doesn't matter how great your workers are, you can't sell a product for $3,000 when others are selling it for $600. Especially when it's a technology still in development. And I know we pay extra for the warm and fuzzies knowing that something is made in the states, but I'm sure the home t…

I think this is the inflection point when the 3D printers went from "local" maker fare to corporate without regard for their users. It's like having a local grass fed product suddenly strike a deal with Whole Foods and expands productions all over the place and are no longer local --they move production to increase capacity but may lose on the localness.

At least it feels that way. It's not the same feeling as if production of cheap sunglasses gets off-shored.

Re: MakerBot Is Outsourcing Its Brooklyn Manufacturing Jobs to China

#96

If Middle America wants those jobs, Middle Americans are welcome to start a fashion label of their own. But since they seem to thrive on blandness in the Midwest I doubt that's going to happen.

seansmccullough is right. It's a breach of HN's civility rule to attack an entire population like that, so please don't do it here.

We detached this subthread from https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11574854 and marked it off-topic.

Re: MakerBot Is Outsourcing Its Brooklyn Manufacturing Jobs to China

#97
post #70
post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I often wonder if costs could be lowered for many of these companies if they would stop locating in some of the country's most expensive places to operate and for their employees to live. I know the arguments about workforce availability and all that, but I've never seen a proper look into it.

Probably. But then there is shipping. If I may stray a bit. The price to ship a small package from Adafruit to a place less than 10 miles cost me around $10.00 - 4 days tops. I can make a similar purchase for a Chinese spoofed version and have it in 7 days, free shipping. I don't know how the heck the shipping from China is so cheap. While to ship anything inside the us is frigging expensive...to ship outside the us…

Slightly off-topic, but that's the real problem. How the hell are we (West) going to compete with China if shipping a small item in the same city, for example where I live now, cost 2-3 €, meanwhile the same item from China cost less and shipping fee to my door is 0! Ordering inside EU is even worse, it's common that shipping costs more than the item itself. Sure, it takes a while for order to arrive from China, but if I'm not in a rush, I don't mind that. I order a lot of mundane things from eBay/Aliexpress just because: a) no/small shipping fee b) it's faster and easier than to look for alternatives in physical shops. Postal system is what really needs an overhaul imho.

Re: MakerBot Is Outsourcing Its Brooklyn Manufacturing Jobs to China

#98
post #70
post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I often wonder if costs could be lowered for many of these companies if they would stop locating in some of the country's most expensive places to operate and for their employees to live. I know the arguments about workforce availability and all that, but I've never seen a proper look into it.

Probably. But then there is shipping. If I may stray a bit. The price to ship a small package from Adafruit to a place less than 10 miles cost me around $10.00 - 4 days tops. I can make a similar purchase for a Chinese spoofed version and have it in 7 days, free shipping. I don't know how the heck the shipping from China is so cheap. While to ship anything inside the us is frigging expensive...to ship outside the us…

Yep, ePacket is amazing.

Re: MakerBot Is Outsourcing Its Brooklyn Manufacturing Jobs to China

#99
post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I often wonder if costs could be lowered for many of these companies if they would stop locating in some of the country's most expensive places to operate and for their employees to live. I know the arguments about workforce availability and all that, but I've never seen a proper look into it.

It still wouldn't help. It's cheaper to manufacture electronics in China even if the labor costs are the same . The logistics are vastly better over there. If you need PCBs or components, you can have them direct from the factory on the same day. If you have a production problem, you can get a specialist engineer the same day. If you need a new production line with 200 extra staff, you can have it up and running in t…

Yea I've spent tons of time in China, and worked with a number of these ODM type companies and smaller factories, and the kinds of things they can get done in short times for small amounts of money is pretty amazing.. Basically why its so hard not to manufacture in china is because of the "factory engineering plus" kind of model. Basically you get low cost engineering work done by the factory to modify your plastic tool, tweak your PCB design, build test fixtures, setup test station software, etc.. Basically one person who knows what they are doing can essentially give a detailed list of instructions to a factory in china and they will just "make it happen" for a really good price.. Since there are so few factories in the US anymore, there are no engineers that work for the factories, so there are very few companies that offer engineering work for low cost, whereas in China the actual factory work pays for the salaries of the engineers. So, its hard to compete with that..
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