Being a Developer After 40 • Hacker News Board

Re: Being a Developer After 40

#231

Post by interpol_p » Tue, Apr 26, 2016, 2:18 PM UTC

exstudent2 wrote: post #199

interpol_p wrote: post #193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because we don't completely know whether preferences differ, or whether cultural biases cause those preferences to differ. I have a young boy and a girl. They are pushed into so many gendered roles from such a young age I have a really hard time trying to figure out what they actually like, versus what society tells them they should like. My son recently picked up a pink toy in a store and said "I can't have this one…

It sounds like your son exercised his free will. Whether you influence him or society does, he ultimately has to be responsible for his choices. Some will be easy, some hard but it's a cliche to disagree with your child's choices. Maybe he's comfortable with his gender and gender roles? Maybe that will help him get a wife someday and you grandchildren. It's not for everyone but maybe it will be for him.

I don’t “disagree with his choices.” I find it frustrating that our culture made him feel ashamed of liking his favourite colour. I find it frustrating that he is made to believe something as arbitrary as a wavelength of light is “for girls.”

A child should never feel ashamed of liking something as simple as a colour. That is ridiculous.

> Maybe he's comfortable with his gender and gender roles? Maybe that will help him get a wife someday and you grandchildren. It's not for everyone but maybe it will be for him.

Are you serious? He can get a wife or whatever he wants when he knows what that is. It is amusing to think that traditional "gender roles" would help in any way with that.

Re: Being a Developer After 40

#232

Post by JoeAltmaier » Tue, Apr 26, 2016, 2:20 PM UTC

shrewduser wrote: post #191

JustSomeNobody wrote: post #180

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Read all the other comments. I basically said the same thing. White Male Privilege means White males have it easier than everyone else, no matter how hard they have it/had it . That's the definition of "white male privilege". I'm not being racist one bit. Just stating a definition.

is it an advantage for a white male from a poor disadvantaged background with little opportunities has to get higher marks to get into a good college than a minority from an affluent background who has been given every opportunity?

No but all the rest is - allowed into a store without being suspected of being a thief. Allowed to apply to that college at all. Allowed to attend a church with influential people who could help. It certainly could have been worse, right? Could have been in that situation, and been black.

Re: Being a Developer After 40

#233

Post by rimantas » Tue, Apr 26, 2016, 2:21 PM UTC

interpol_p wrote: post #193

reefoctopus wrote: post #168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Stop calling it a problem. Why is it a problem that preferences differ? Is it a problem that more women aren't miners or plumbers?

Because we don't completely know whether preferences differ, or whether cultural biases cause those preferences to differ. I have a young boy and a girl. They are pushed into so many gendered roles from such a young age I have a really hard time trying to figure out what they actually like, versus what society tells them they should like. My son recently picked up a pink toy in a store and said "I can't have this one…

So don't call it a problem if you don't know it is a problem.

Re: Being a Developer After 40

#234

Post by lbebber » Tue, Apr 26, 2016, 2:22 PM UTC

maratd wrote: post #223

lbebber wrote: post #208

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Indeed, various groups of white people have suffered varying levels of prejudice, but 1- it doesn't compare to what, for example, black or chinese people or native americans suffered historically and 2- most of the prejudice against these groups has been forgotten, whereas prejudice against "people of color" is still very much alive.

> but 1- it doesn't compare to what, for example, black or chinese people or native americans suffered historically And that doesn't compare to what Jews went through 50 years ago. What's your point? There's always a bigger sob story around the corner. You deal with it and move on . The moving on part is important. > whereas prejudice against "people of color" is still very much alive. And that prejudice will amplify…

The point is that he was saying that groups of white people had the same as people of color, and that's not true. They had it bad, but it's not remotely comparable.

Re: Being a Developer After 40

#235

Post by cheez » Tue, Apr 26, 2016, 2:23 PM UTC

ManlyBread wrote: post #105

The article was pretty good until this part. >If you are a white male remember all the privilege you have enjoyed since birth just because you were born that way. It is your responsibility to change the industry and its bias towards more inclusion. I'm from an Eastern Europe and my family never was rich, I had to put in a tremendous effort to even get into the industry. Assuming I got an easy ride simply because I'm…

White privilege is reduced sentencing for white people, as compared to people of colour and things like that.

My personal opinion is not that you should bring yourself down and suffer for people of colour, but just know that you have benefited from these little effects throughout your entire life. As Warren Buffet said, these "snowball" into a pretty comfortable life.

I was a 17 year old non-white guy, minding my own business, and I was detained for matching a description. Who? Why? Nope, just matching a description. I was in the system now. Every time I have to deal with the system, I fight to make sure there are no traces. And every few years, I have to do so. Meanwhile, my white friends who work in the financial industry transport drugs across state lines and never have any issues, even if they are pulled over. I know, because I travelled with them once and I was the only one who was questioned for any length of time.

What the actual fuck?

I mean, it was a nice trip, but seriously? I don't even know where to buy drugs.

This is what life is like for someone who isn't white. Over and over, day in and day out. It honestly gets really tiring.

I'm not complaining, it just makes my success that much sweeter.

Re: Being a Developer After 40

#236

Post by blub » Tue, Apr 26, 2016, 2:23 PM UTC

megablast wrote: post #120

blub wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find it quite bizarre that remote workers living in a country with lower cost of living are expected to take lower pay than locals while doing the same work and offering the same value. Otherwise yes, people are allowed to express silly things and one shouldn't prevent them from doing so, especially when they show their true colors. Looks to me like they dodged a bullet.

> with lower cost of living are expected to take lower pay than locals while doing the same work and offering the same value DO you also think it is weird that people who live in incredibly expensive cities like NY or SF should get paid more money then?

I don't think the customer of a remote contractor should care much what costs the contractor has. It's the contractor's job to deliver enough value so that they can charge enough to cover their cost of living and make a profit.

Re: Being a Developer After 40

#237

Post by hueving » Tue, Apr 26, 2016, 2:23 PM UTC

fucking_tragedy wrote: post #198

j4kp07 wrote: post #188

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It just means, for example, that it probably would have been even harder if you were an Eastern European woman who grew up in a poor family. That is an absurd, subjective, abstract theory with no research to back it. The same thing can be said of any sex, race or creed in virtually any instance of life. Get over yourself and quit acting like this is exclusive to white people. White people did not invent sexism. Nei…

If we are talking about America, certain white people certainly profited from stirring up racism here for centuries. We don't even have to look back to when slavery was legal, the blatant use of racism and dog-whistle politics to gain white racist's votes is well documented as being the core tenet to the Southern strategy.

Some white people a long time ago had slaves, therefore all white people including those that immigrated just recently are unfairly privileged. Yawn. It's such a nonsensical argument that I'm surprised anyone can even use it in a non sarcastic way.

Re: Being a Developer After 40

#238

Post by gedy » Tue, Apr 26, 2016, 2:23 PM UTC

JohnBooty wrote: post #149

ManlyBread wrote: post #105

The article was pretty good until this part. >If you are a white male remember all the privilege you have enjoyed since birth just because you were born that way. It is your responsibility to change the industry and its bias towards more inclusion. I'm from an Eastern Europe and my family never was rich, I had to put in a tremendous effort to even get into the industry. Assuming I got an easy ride simply because I'm…

I'm from an Eastern Europe and my family never was rich, I had to put in a tremendous effort to even get into the industry. Assuming I got an easy ride simply because I'm white is a pretty racist statement I was about to patiently type out another "hey, you did work hard and you did earn your success - 'white privilege' doesn't mean things were handed to you easily; it means that even though your life has been hard y…

> you know what? We're doing it wrong.

How about you just call it "privilege" and leave it at that? This skin color labelling is pointless in the context of real privilege.

A "woman of color" who grew up with servants in her birth country, went to private schools, top colleges, etc has a better chance at the C-suite than a Eastern European "white guy" who grew up poor and went to state schools etc.

Re: Being a Developer After 40

#239

Post by saiya-jin » Tue, Apr 26, 2016, 2:23 PM UTC

maratd wrote: post #214

mhurron wrote: post #181

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> basic rights we take for granted (for example, walking into a store and not being treated as a potential thief, or having prospective interviewers assume we're professional/literate/presentable) are actually privileges that many people or color don't have. You are aware that Irish and Eastern Europeans, and on and off through history Greek and Italian, have had all those same problems right? You know that 'White Pr…

> It jsut paints such a simplistic view of the world, not a real one, but one that is useful for rhetoric. Bingo. Race is just one facet anyway. We're all born with various advantages and disadvantages, none of which we have any control over. Just as an example, some people are better looking than others ... and those people tend to have an advantage, because they're better looking. They can get better jobs, better p…

seeing this upvoted gives me back a bit of hope in HN crowd

Re: Being a Developer After 40

#240

Post by a-saleh » Tue, Apr 26, 2016, 2:24 PM UTC

ManlyBread wrote: post #105

The article was pretty good until this part. >If you are a white male remember all the privilege you have enjoyed since birth just because you were born that way. It is your responsibility to change the industry and its bias towards more inclusion. I'm from an Eastern Europe and my family never was rich, I had to put in a tremendous effort to even get into the industry. Assuming I got an easy ride simply because I'm…

> Assuming I got an easy ride simply because I'm white is a pretty racist statement and I find myself surprised that no one is calling out the author on it.

I wouldn't say you got an easy ride, just that your ride was easier than some others had it?

It might be a cultural thing, but I know that some of my neighbours wouldn't consider me white. Probably because I didn't have the time to shave and I really like my keffiyeh arround my neck and suddenly I might get these looks of "What does this stinking arab do on my street?"

Based on this, I think I agree with the notion that it is my responsibility to change the industry and its bias towards more inclusion. And I don't mean in "we need more quotas" sense, more in "when you see BS, call on it".

I think this is why he mentions "I am making 135 KCHF per year. That was my current salary. How about you? And you? The more we speak out, the less inequality there will be." Based on this, I think I can empathise.