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Sebastian Thrun Steps Down as Udacity's CEO

fortune.com

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Re: Sebastian Thrun Steps Down as Udacity's CEO

#51

Post by skywhopper »

Artoemius wrote: post #5

I wonder what is hidden behind the phrase "the college partnerships failed". I took some great courses on Udacity, Coursera, and edX back in the days when they regularly offered amazing comprehensive college courses for free. They do still offer free courses. However, it seems that the atmosphere of free accessible education is somehow lost, with the advent of the "specializations" and "nanodegrees" and the like. Or…

The main problem is that great courses require great faculty to create and manage them semester by semester. Udacity and the like are built on the premise that we can scale up a professor's reach by orders of magnitude. But you can't do that without losing quality. The state of online course software is such that in most cases it's a hindrance, rather than a help. Software should make our jobs easier, but for professors building an online course versus building a traditional lecture/paper/chalkboard sort of course, technology far too often gets in the way and makes their jobs harder.

Re: Sebastian Thrun Steps Down as Udacity's CEO

#52

Post by pj_mukh »

Fede_V wrote: post #45

The original business model of coursera/udacity was to offer the option to take most courses for free, but require people to pay for credentials. This is not obviously a bad idea: the quality of teaching at Harvard or Stanford is probably better than that you obtain in most universities, but the one of the main added values are the network of people you meet, and the credential of having attended a very prestigious u…

Maybe they could've focussed on making the credentials valuable (maybe they did and it didn't work). AFAIK, if you told an employer you have a "nanodegree" in something or other, its glossed over.

Usually, you have to back it up with real-world projects. In which case why would I pay for the degree, I should just go out and build something with the stuff I learn for free.

Re: Sebastian Thrun Steps Down as Udacity's CEO

#53

Post by TillE »

kumarski wrote: post #20

I don't think technology will revolutionize education the way everyone in Silicon Valley thinks it will. Accessibility issues, yes. Disrupting traditional teaching, learning, practicing....hmmm?

I think just about everyone would be delighted if recorded lectures completely replace traditional giant lectures.

But I agree, there's much more to the structure of education that technology can help with, but not supplant. Universities aren't going away (or radically changing) any time soon.

Re: Sebastian Thrun Steps Down as Udacity's CEO

#54

Post by CardenB »

nkozyra wrote: post #43
dikaiosune wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How would you rate the rest of the experience?

Not the addressee but it's spectacular all around. There are a few classes that have a reputation for being poorly designed/maintained and a few with somewhat "unreasonable" time requirements (ie 50 hours a week for a single class). There are classes where you only interact with TAs/students (which is fine) and some where the professor is seemingly on a 24-hour modafinil drip, there to answer any question posed at an…

"There are a few classes that have a reputation for being poorly designed/maintained and a few with somewhat "unreasonable" time requirements (ie 50 hours a week for a single class)."

As a current Georgia Tech student, I welcome you.

Re: Sebastian Thrun Steps Down as Udacity's CEO

#55

Post by ghaff »

pj_mukh wrote: post #52
Fede_V wrote: post #45

The original business model of coursera/udacity was to offer the option to take most courses for free, but require people to pay for credentials. This is not obviously a bad idea: the quality of teaching at Harvard or Stanford is probably better than that you obtain in most universities, but the one of the main added values are the network of people you meet, and the credential of having attended a very prestigious u…

Maybe they could've focussed on making the credentials valuable (maybe they did and it didn't work). AFAIK, if you told an employer you have a "nanodegree" in something or other, its glossed over. Usually, you have to back it up with real-world projects. In which case why would I pay for the degree, I should just go out and build something with the stuff I learn for free.

Oh, I'm pretty sure they were all aware that credential value was ultimately going to have to be a pretty important component of getting people to pay more than a token amount. But the value of credentials is much more something that others confer on the credential than something the credentialing organization can confer on itself.

Sure, the organization can attempt to explain and promote how its credential provides evidence of X, Y, Z skills or knowledge. Which works reasonably for both well-established institutions and narrow vocational training (including in IT). But it's a lot harder to make a case that random MOOC course provides evidence of much other than a generalized interest in continuing education (for which you don't really need a credential to prove).

Re: Sebastian Thrun Steps Down as Udacity's CEO

#56

Post by qntmfred »

canistr wrote: post #14
Artoemius wrote: post #5

I wonder what is hidden behind the phrase "the college partnerships failed". I took some great courses on Udacity, Coursera, and edX back in the days when they regularly offered amazing comprehensive college courses for free. They do still offer free courses. However, it seems that the atmosphere of free accessible education is somehow lost, with the advent of the "specializations" and "nanodegrees" and the like. Or…

As a current Georgia Tech student doing the Online Master's in CS, I wonder this too because it's the primary method of delivery for lectures. For the most part, I'm not crazy about the Udacity platform and the lectures (they're too short, the mini-quizzes aren't always that great, and the platform doesn't feel like it has been improving in the past 2 years). However, all the value and learning is coming from the int…

this was the primary failure they're referring to

https://www.insidehighered.com/news/2013/07/18/citing-disapp...

Re: Sebastian Thrun Steps Down as Udacity's CEO

#57

Post by robbiemitchell »

skywhopper wrote: post #51
Artoemius wrote: post #5

I wonder what is hidden behind the phrase "the college partnerships failed". I took some great courses on Udacity, Coursera, and edX back in the days when they regularly offered amazing comprehensive college courses for free. They do still offer free courses. However, it seems that the atmosphere of free accessible education is somehow lost, with the advent of the "specializations" and "nanodegrees" and the like. Or…

The main problem is that great courses require great faculty to create and manage them semester by semester. Udacity and the like are built on the premise that we can scale up a professor's reach by orders of magnitude. But you can't do that without losing quality. The state of online course software is such that in most cases it's a hindrance, rather than a help. Software should make our jobs easier, but for profess…

The assumption that classes should be taught on a semester ("seat time") basis, with everyone starting and stopping at the same time, is a professor-centric view of the world.

A student-centric view would use technology to help students have an educational experience around their own schedule and needs (e.g., varied pace; reinforcement or skipping where appropriate).

Re: Sebastian Thrun Steps Down as Udacity's CEO

#58

Post by coredog64 »

pj_mukh wrote: post #52
Fede_V wrote: post #45

The original business model of coursera/udacity was to offer the option to take most courses for free, but require people to pay for credentials. This is not obviously a bad idea: the quality of teaching at Harvard or Stanford is probably better than that you obtain in most universities, but the one of the main added values are the network of people you meet, and the credential of having attended a very prestigious u…

Maybe they could've focussed on making the credentials valuable (maybe they did and it didn't work). AFAIK, if you told an employer you have a "nanodegree" in something or other, its glossed over. Usually, you have to back it up with real-world projects. In which case why would I pay for the degree, I should just go out and build something with the stuff I learn for free.

I started on a Udacity cert program, but had to drop it due to time constraints. The capstone of the program is/was a real-world project.

While I never signed up for the nanodegree track, it appears those are similar.

Re: Sebastian Thrun Steps Down as Udacity's CEO

#59

Post by robbiemitchell »

Fede_V wrote: post #45

The original business model of coursera/udacity was to offer the option to take most courses for free, but require people to pay for credentials. This is not obviously a bad idea: the quality of teaching at Harvard or Stanford is probably better than that you obtain in most universities, but the one of the main added values are the network of people you meet, and the credential of having attended a very prestigious u…

What about current college students?

If it were possible for a good student at _any_ school to take online courses _for credit_ at an Ivy, and perhaps to even work toward a new "dual" degree that joins both institutions, I suspect the demand would be there. They're already using borrowed money.

Re: Sebastian Thrun Steps Down as Udacity's CEO

#60

Post by tobz »

Artoemius wrote: post #5

I wonder what is hidden behind the phrase "the college partnerships failed". I took some great courses on Udacity, Coursera, and edX back in the days when they regularly offered amazing comprehensive college courses for free. They do still offer free courses. However, it seems that the atmosphere of free accessible education is somehow lost, with the advent of the "specializations" and "nanodegrees" and the like. Or…

(edX employee here)

I'm not particular privy to whatever tactical insight our leadership has on Udacity, Coursera, etc... but I can tell you where edX is looking to head as a MOOC when it comes to college/university partnerships.

We have our partner-developed content. This is stuff like Harvard's CS50, MIT's 6.00.1x, etc. High quality content. People are very eager to take the courses -- they're developed by professors, TAs, etc, from these schools, and, to be honest, there's a lot of front-loaded name recognition -- but there's also a good chunk of learners who go on to pay for a verified certificate. On the flipside, we've talked to major businesses (tens of thousands of employees) who say they're willing to treat these certificates, the output of these courses, in line with their campus equivalents. That's pretty huge for someone looking to beef up their resume.

The next evolution of what we're doing by partnering with these institutions are things like Arizona State University's Global Freshman Academy or MIT's MicroMasters. ASU's Global Freshman Academy is taking your entire "freshman" year on edX, and getting real credit from it. MIT's MicroMasters (in Supply Chain Management) is taking a semester online, which makes you eligible for taking the rest of the degree (which is two semesters total) on campus. These cost money; they aren't entirely free like the standard courses on edX. However, they're deeply discounted and this is what our learners say they want.

Many people want credentials, they want them from top colleges and universities, and they want them targeted to specific fields. Ultimately, these people just don't feel confident figuring out which courses to take, and they want to be told which courses to take to get them to a specific place: better comprehension of X, better chances of job in a given field, etc. This is what is precipitating a lot of the advent of the specializations/nanodegrees, as you say.

(sorry, a little long-winded)

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