William Shakespeare, Playwright and Poet, Is Dead at 52 • Hacker News Board

Re: William Shakespeare, Playwright and Poet, Is Dead at 52

#21

Post by shiro » Sun, Apr 24, 2016, 2:25 AM UTC

whateveridunno wrote: post #16

ams6110 wrote: post #13

Sadly (?) the only memories I have of Shakespeare are the forced readings in my sophomore (Julius Caesar) and junior (King Lear) years in high school, both of which I hated and for which Cliff's Notes were my crutch to get through.

I thought it was illegal not to have read Hamlet by 21? Seriously though, give it another try. Shakespeare's wide-ranging enough that there's likely to be something to your taste. And with his comedies, especially, I'd recommend watching Shakespeare and not reading him- that's how his plays were meant to be experienced. Although it's nice to read an annotated version and discover all the (often dirty) jokes you didn'…

Grown up in Japan and got into theatre, I've tried a few of Shakespeare (in Japanese translations), but I didn't fully get it---until I came to US and actually read it aloud in English. I agree that it is much more approachable as spoken words.

Re: William Shakespeare, Playwright and Poet, Is Dead at 52

#22

Post by henrikschroder » Sun, Apr 24, 2016, 2:28 AM UTC

whateveridunno wrote: post #16

ams6110 wrote: post #13

Sadly (?) the only memories I have of Shakespeare are the forced readings in my sophomore (Julius Caesar) and junior (King Lear) years in high school, both of which I hated and for which Cliff's Notes were my crutch to get through.

I thought it was illegal not to have read Hamlet by 21? Seriously though, give it another try. Shakespeare's wide-ranging enough that there's likely to be something to your taste. And with his comedies, especially, I'd recommend watching Shakespeare and not reading him- that's how his plays were meant to be experienced. Although it's nice to read an annotated version and discover all the (often dirty) jokes you didn'…

One thing that never ceases to amaze me is that there are so many succesful modern retellings of his plays. Something about the stories are just timeless.

Watch the originals, by all means, but the reimagined ones are not too shabby either:

Romeo + Juliet, modern day "Verona Beach"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4VBsi0VxiLg

Much Ado About Nothing, set in modern days:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WnmZc8uoEbo

Hamlet, set in the 1800's

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-rd74Gniz-A

Richard III, set in WW2:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OXc0-EME0C8

Re: William Shakespeare, Playwright and Poet, Is Dead at 52

#23

Post by mewse » Sun, Apr 24, 2016, 2:30 AM UTC

whateveridunno wrote: post #16

ams6110 wrote: post #13

Sadly (?) the only memories I have of Shakespeare are the forced readings in my sophomore (Julius Caesar) and junior (King Lear) years in high school, both of which I hated and for which Cliff's Notes were my crutch to get through.

I thought it was illegal not to have read Hamlet by 21? Seriously though, give it another try. Shakespeare's wide-ranging enough that there's likely to be something to your taste. And with his comedies, especially, I'd recommend watching Shakespeare and not reading him- that's how his plays were meant to be experienced. Although it's nice to read an annotated version and discover all the (often dirty) jokes you didn'…

As someone new to Shakespeare, you should definitely start out by watching performances, rather than reading scripts. Until you've absorbed the rhythm and the literary style, it can be very difficult to follow their plots just from a cold reading of the text; particularly for the histories. (And while King Lear is classed as a tragedy, I've personally always felt that it reads more like one of the histories)

If you do start reading the scripts for pleasure (which totally is not required!), then it's probably a good idea to start with one which you've seen performed, just to let your brain adapt itself to seeing the words in written form, and to get used to looking back and forth between the text and the annotations, without needing to worry about losing the plot.

Re: William Shakespeare, Playwright and Poet, Is Dead at 52

#24

Post by mirimir » Sun, Apr 24, 2016, 2:49 AM UTC

dclowd9901 wrote: post #17

mirimir wrote: post #14

> “To be or not to be,” said Hamlet, prince of Denmark, “that is the question.” Yesterday, Hamlet’s creator was; today, he is not. Of that there is no question. OK, so I'm moved to quote Samuel Butler: > To himself everyone is immortal; he may know that he is going to die, but he can never know that he is dead. I got that (as I recall) from Peter Watts' Echopraxia . It's rather comforting, because I can always imagin…

When I wake up and my first thought is "I'm alive!" It's actually going to be a good day.

Right. And when my first thought is "WTF?", it helps to think "At least I'm alive!" ;)

Re: William Shakespeare, Playwright and Poet, Is Dead at 52

#25

Post by honua » Sun, Apr 24, 2016, 3:07 AM UTC

fullshark wrote: post #18

I don't get it

I agree in that I'm wondering if this is related to Prince dying?

Re: William Shakespeare, Playwright and Poet, Is Dead at 52

#26

Post by jrapdx3 » Sun, Apr 24, 2016, 3:11 AM UTC

mewse wrote: post #23

whateveridunno wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I thought it was illegal not to have read Hamlet by 21? Seriously though, give it another try. Shakespeare's wide-ranging enough that there's likely to be something to your taste. And with his comedies, especially, I'd recommend watching Shakespeare and not reading him- that's how his plays were meant to be experienced. Although it's nice to read an annotated version and discover all the (often dirty) jokes you didn'…

As someone new to Shakespeare, you should definitely start out by watching performances, rather than reading scripts. Until you've absorbed the rhythm and the literary style, it can be very difficult to follow their plots just from a cold reading of the text; particularly for the histories. (And while King Lear is classed as a tragedy, I've personally always felt that it reads more like one of the histories) If you d…

Over the years I've seen (heard) a lot of Shakespeare plays, and I mostly agree with you. Yes, just reading the play is inadequate because the written form is so bare. Attending a live performance is a much better experience. The dialog is meant to be spoken and to be heard.

What I do recommend, and is my own practice, is reading the play before going to the performance. We are especially blessed to read Shakespeare today, the internet is so very helpful. So many versions of every Shakespeare play, most have annotations about Elizabethan language that help the reader make sense of it.

Reading AOT makes it much easier to follow what's happening on stage. Even small local productions can be done well, Shakespearean plays were always meant as entertainment, go and enjoy!

I think you are right about the classification of the plays, Comedy, Tragedy, etc, don't necessarily fit our modern sensibilities. In Shakespeare's time, "Merchant of Venice" was called a "comedy", but in our era we'd say it's more tragic than not. I'd agree familiarity with the play is more important than its categorization.

Re: William Shakespeare, Playwright and Poet, Is Dead at 52

#27

Post by omegaham » Sun, Apr 24, 2016, 3:15 AM UTC

mewse wrote: post #23

whateveridunno wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I thought it was illegal not to have read Hamlet by 21? Seriously though, give it another try. Shakespeare's wide-ranging enough that there's likely to be something to your taste. And with his comedies, especially, I'd recommend watching Shakespeare and not reading him- that's how his plays were meant to be experienced. Although it's nice to read an annotated version and discover all the (often dirty) jokes you didn'…

As someone new to Shakespeare, you should definitely start out by watching performances, rather than reading scripts. Until you've absorbed the rhythm and the literary style, it can be very difficult to follow their plots just from a cold reading of the text; particularly for the histories. (And while King Lear is classed as a tragedy, I've personally always felt that it reads more like one of the histories) If you d…

This. Plays were the movies of their time; they were meant to be watched. The scripts are great, too, but they're supposed to accompany the play, not the other way around.

It's like reading the lyrics to a song. Sure, some lyrics are absolutely fantastic in their own right, but they were meant to be sung to music, not just read by themselves.

Hell, even with music, some bands go from being mediocre to flat-out amazing when they perform live.

Re: William Shakespeare, Playwright and Poet, Is Dead at 52

#28

Post by justifier » Sun, Apr 24, 2016, 3:16 AM UTC

ams6110 wrote: post #13

Sadly (?) the only memories I have of Shakespeare are the forced readings in my sophomore (Julius Caesar) and junior (King Lear) years in high school, both of which I hated and for which Cliff's Notes were my crutch to get through.

i think there is a lot to be enjoyed in his writings, i would encourage you to reinvestigate his work

the other comments in response to yours speak well of approaching his work

    LEAR
    How old art thou?
    
    KENT
    Not so young, sir, to love a woman for singing, 
    nor so old to dote on her for anything.

who answers the question 'how old are you?' like this? what does that even mean?

i love the way shakespeare densely muses on social and personal issues indirectly whilst playing with language and dialogue

i sometimes read his works like others read holy books, meaning i'll just open up to a random spot and read a few lines until i find just an immeasurably unique use of language and close it satisified

shakespeare wrote for the pit and penny people, the work is intended to be fun, it just happens to also be brilliant

Re: William Shakespeare, Playwright and Poet, Is Dead at 52

#29

Post by justifier » Sun, Apr 24, 2016, 3:26 AM UTC

mewse wrote: post #23

whateveridunno wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I thought it was illegal not to have read Hamlet by 21? Seriously though, give it another try. Shakespeare's wide-ranging enough that there's likely to be something to your taste. And with his comedies, especially, I'd recommend watching Shakespeare and not reading him- that's how his plays were meant to be experienced. Although it's nice to read an annotated version and discover all the (often dirty) jokes you didn'…

As someone new to Shakespeare, you should definitely start out by watching performances, rather than reading scripts. Until you've absorbed the rhythm and the literary style, it can be very difficult to follow their plots just from a cold reading of the text; particularly for the histories. (And while King Lear is classed as a tragedy, I've personally always felt that it reads more like one of the histories) If you d…

> Until you've absorbed the rhythm and the literary style

also reading outloud helps

i used to tell people the first one will take you two months, the second one will take you two weeks, and the third one will take you two days

i meant it as playful encouragement but i think it may have put some people off

also, i just like taking more time with texts than it takes me to read them

it took me two weeks to read the first sentence of basho's oku no hosomichi:

"moon and sun are passing figures of countless generations and years coming or going wanderers too"

Re: William Shakespeare, Playwright and Poet, Is Dead at 52

#30

Post by mhurron » Sun, Apr 24, 2016, 3:35 AM UTC

themartorana wrote: post #6

icebraining wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of the six signatures, three are abbreviations, and the other three don't coincide among themselves. Besides, he did use the modern form when he wrote his name in print, just not in his signature. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spelling_of_Shakespeare's_name

Oh be quiet with your logic and evidence. In the Romantic and Victorian eras the spelling "Shakspere", as used in the poet's own signature, became more widely adopted in the belief that this was the most authentic version. I guess I lean this way. (I do acknowledge what you said about the man himself spelling his own name differently, makes me wonder why...) But I have always been perplexed about different spellings…

> My name is Dave in every language

No it most likely is not. For one it is a short form of the name David, so it has already been mangled, and then like any other written word will change how it is written to attempt to show the sounds in the written rules of that language. This can lead to additions of letters or some very strange changes to the spelling of the name.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_%28name%29

"Hebrew: דָּוִד, Modern David, Tiberian Dāwîḏ ... In Christian tradition, the name was adopted as Syriac: ܕܘܝܕ‎ Dawid, Greek Δαυίδ, Latin Davidus. The Quranic spelling is داوُد Dāwūd."

So just around the Mediterranean, where the name originated, we have (in the English alphabet) Dawid, David, Davidus, Dawud. All for the same name.