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Apple Services Shut Down in China in Startling About-Face

nytimes.com

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Re: Apple Services Shut Down in China in Startling About-Face

#41

Post by philovivero »

soperj wrote: post #38
jonknee wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple isn't most American companies.

Yeah, most American companies don't collude to screw their workers.

I'm with kittypryde. I'll take a cite on that.

Last I heard, Google, Facebook, Yahoo, Adobe, and a huge slew of smaller tech companies (if you want to stay in the same industry as Apple) had all colluded together to suppress wages.

I have a hard time believing anyone who claims this was an exception to a rule. It seems far more likely to believe it is the rule.

Re: Apple Services Shut Down in China in Startling About-Face

#43

Post by blackguardx »

3pt14159 wrote: post #2

China has to play fairly carefully with Apple. On the one hand it's an American company that puts microphones and cameras into the cafes, offices, and bedrooms of many of their citizenry; but on the other hand, with decreasing competitiveness due to rising wages there isn't anything specifically _stopping_ Apple or other American tech companies from moving manufacturing out of China. Foxconn alone employs about 4.3 m…

Foxconn is Taiwanese and has many factories around the world already.

Re: Apple Services Shut Down in China in Startling About-Face

#44

Post by xigency »

tekklloneer wrote: post #9
xigency wrote: post #5

It shouldn't be too surprising with China's history of censorship that they would ban iTunes from selling books and movies to their citizens. What's surprising is that they apparently allowed it for several months.

It would be very likely that Apple was following by "the rules".

How could they? The communist party would have to literally read every book and watch every movie for approval, so to really go by the rules, the only content they could offer is media in favor of the cultural revolution. I doubt Apple even tried to play it like that, so why be surprised when it's shut down?

Re: Apple Services Shut Down in China in Startling About-Face

#45

Post by WildUtah »

soperj wrote: post #27
toomuchtodo wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Apple's profits are largely due to the cheap labor market (just like many other companies) Foxconn is replacing millions of workers in China with robotics. Couldn't Apple acquire these same robotics, perform their own manufacturing in the US (remember, substantial tax breaks in the US for equipment purchases!), and then lease out any spare capacity. Seems its all coming back to US shores. As a US citizen, I don't m…

Not really since all the components that actually make the phone are also made in China.

None of the complicated components are made in Red China. The CPUs are made in Korea, the cameras in Japan, the batteries in Japan, and the power control circuits in Free China, The CNC machines, and glass cutting instruments are made in Germany and the USA. The software is American as motherhood and apple pie.

Red Chinese fingers do the final assembly and Red Chinese tax laws provide loopholes but iPhones are not a Red Chinese product.

Re: Apple Services Shut Down in China in Startling About-Face

#46

Post by codeisawesome »

makecheck wrote: post #10
3pt14159 wrote: post #2

China has to play fairly carefully with Apple. On the one hand it's an American company that puts microphones and cameras into the cafes, offices, and bedrooms of many of their citizenry; but on the other hand, with decreasing competitiveness due to rising wages there isn't anything specifically _stopping_ Apple or other American tech companies from moving manufacturing out of China. Foxconn alone employs about 4.3 m…

And Apple has one of the best chances to make real change here because they can afford to spend a hell of a lot of money without their short-term business being hurt. They could, for instance, speculatively set up entire facilities in new areas, hire staff, and experiment with parallel development of the same products to measure how well the new bring-up is going.

Why will they do it? Corporate entities like Apple exist to make profits. Change is not on the agenda. It's not healthy to be that hopeful when you're setting yourself up for disappointment.

Re: Apple Services Shut Down in China in Startling About-Face

#47

Post by 3nki »

Steko wrote: post #11
3pt14159 wrote: post #2

China has to play fairly carefully with Apple. On the one hand it's an American company that puts microphones and cameras into the cafes, offices, and bedrooms of many of their citizenry; but on the other hand, with decreasing competitiveness due to rising wages there isn't anything specifically _stopping_ Apple or other American tech companies from moving manufacturing out of China. Foxconn alone employs about 4.3 m…

I think you've got it backwards, it's Apple that needs China's market and China basicallly has them over a barrel on these secondary products. What China has to be careful of is eventually the US/EU decide to get tough on Chinese protectionism and impose significant barriers to goods manufactured in China. And that would also be bad for Apple again since they make their stuff in China.

If China keeps giving western tech companies a hard time they might stop making their stuff in China. That would hurt the Chinese economy far more than they gain by local companies taking a little business from Apple and such.

Re: Apple Services Shut Down in China in Startling About-Face

#48

Post by frankchn »

xigency wrote: post #44
tekklloneer wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It would be very likely that Apple was following by "the rules".

How could they? The communist party would have to literally read every book and watch every movie for approval, so to really go by the rules, the only content they could offer is media in favor of the cultural revolution. I doubt Apple even tried to play it like that, so why be surprised when it's shut down?

There are bookstores (both online and brick-and-mortar) with a large number of books approved for sale in China, so if Apple stuck to selling those books, it would not be a censorship issue.

Re: Apple Services Shut Down in China in Startling About-Face

#49

Post by xigency »

frankchn wrote: post #48
xigency wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How could they? The communist party would have to literally read every book and watch every movie for approval, so to really go by the rules, the only content they could offer is media in favor of the cultural revolution. I doubt Apple even tried to play it like that, so why be surprised when it's shut down?

There are bookstores (both online and brick-and-mortar) with a large number of books approved for sale in China, so if Apple stuck to selling those books, it would not be a censorship issue.

Fair enough.

Apple needed to put more thought and effort into their launch if they were considering becoming a mainstay in a completely different political/cultural market.

Others have pointed out that China's closure to outside (software) tech. has helped them as an incubator, but really I think American companies have failed to bend their policies to the degree necessary to continue to exist (in China). Google for a while has tried to resist censorship, but it's really a question of whether a company wants the one billion Chinese citizens to have access to their products at all, or if they would like to be shutout.

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