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Solar is now cheaper than some coal, says India energy minister

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Re: Solar is now cheaper than some coal, says India energy minister

#141

Post by iSnow »

dexterdog wrote: post #115
netcan wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is some other interesting economics at play. Solar is more suitable for local, small scale production for a few reasons including relative costs and the way those costs are distributed (capital cost vs variable cost). That in itself is interesting for all sorts of reasons, many of them applying to countries like India with infrastructure difficulties. About 7 years ago I visited Cow Bay, north of Cairns, Austra…

Can't the same be said for local nuclear?

In the age of global terrorism, local nuclear is a no-go from the start.

Dirty bombs hardly make sense in terms of headcount, but their psychological effects would be tremendous. Therefore, security around nuclear installations will remain high - and that's easier to organize and cheaper around big, centralized stations.

Re: Solar is now cheaper than some coal, says India energy minister

#142

Post by downandout »

Kliment wrote: post #121
downandout wrote: post #119

"Solar energy prices hit a new record low in January with the auction of 420 megawatts in Rajasthan at 4.34 rupees a kilowatt-hour. In comparison coal tariffs range between 3-5 rupees/kWh." So the headline here is, as is usually the case with articles in this space, misleading at best. It's slightly cheaper than the highest-end coal, but dramatically more expensive - nearly 1.5X more - than the lower end. Overall, it…

The comparison is between the cost of new installations - coal power is very cheap because the facilities are old and the capital expenses were sunk a long time ago. New solar power is now cheaper to build out than new coal plants, which is reasonable enough given the cost of both raw materials and production processes for solar had plummeted over the last decade whereas coal is a very mature technology that is effec…

>The comparison is between the cost of new installations

That may be, but that isn't what the headline says. It simply says that solar is cheaper than coal, which of course is not the case right now.

Re: Solar is now cheaper than some coal, says India energy minister

#143

Post by aub3bhat »

downandout wrote: post #119

"Solar energy prices hit a new record low in January with the auction of 420 megawatts in Rajasthan at 4.34 rupees a kilowatt-hour. In comparison coal tariffs range between 3-5 rupees/kWh." So the headline here is, as is usually the case with articles in this space, misleading at best. It's slightly cheaper than the highest-end coal, but dramatically more expensive - nearly 1.5X more - than the lower end. Overall, it…

Rajasthan is mostly an arid desert with huge amount of area where nothing can grow. Solar power is an ideal fit for amount unused land available.

Re: Solar is now cheaper than some coal, says India energy minister

#145

Post by iSnow »

rathish_g wrote: post #30

India has made huge investments in Solar and is gradually paying off. 1.World's first solar power airport is in India http://money.cnn.com/2016/03/14/technology/india-cochin-sola... 2.Solar power from dams http://articles.economictimes.indiatimes.com/2014-11-10/news...

Wasn't there some WTO ruling against India just recently that will make solar more expensive there?

Re: Solar is now cheaper than some coal, says India energy minister

#147

Post by Osiris30 »

downandout wrote: post #119

"Solar energy prices hit a new record low in January with the auction of 420 megawatts in Rajasthan at 4.34 rupees a kilowatt-hour. In comparison coal tariffs range between 3-5 rupees/kWh." So the headline here is, as is usually the case with articles in this space, misleading at best. It's slightly cheaper than the highest-end coal, but dramatically more expensive - nearly 1.5X more - than the lower end. Overall, it…

No. See https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11524691

Why does solar always need batteries? These are not "advances". India is adding 20k MW of solar and 10k MW of wind p.a. China is at 20+20. US at 20+20. Europe at 20+20.

30% of all new power capacity additions globally will be from renewables for the foreseeable future. Probably more.

This is without "batteries". Without subsidies.

The need for "baseload", "storage", or "the sun doesn't always shine and the wind doesn't always blow" are red herrings. They are not relevant.

Whether we like it or not, driven by massive cost and technology improvements, solar and wind are here in a massive way.

Re: Solar is now cheaper than some coal, says India energy minister

#148

Post by Osiris30 »

sambe wrote: post #45

This was in my inbox this morning: http://www.vox.com/2016/4/18/11415510/solar-power-costs-inno... Suggesting that costs are not falling fast enough to overcome value deflation. Seems quite US-focussed though. The numbers in the two articles don't seem directly comparable.

This is being discussed at

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11520789

Re: Solar is now cheaper than some coal, says India energy minister

#149

Post by Osiris30 »

stevetrewick wrote: post #73

Only if it includes the price of all the overcapacity and storage required to produce baseload and still comes in lower can solar be considered to cheaper than coal (or more usefully whatever fossil/nuclear mix is actually currently providing that).

No. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11520789

Re: Solar is now cheaper than some coal, says India energy minister

#150

Post by Osiris30 »

forrestthewoods wrote: post #14
starving_coder wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From the article: “Of course there are challenges of 24/7 power. We accept all of that – but we have been able to come up with a solar-based long term vision that is not subsidy based.” Headline is not possible at face value except that it is.

As best I can tell India's government is currently spending billions of dollars on solar. Maybe it will some day not be subsidy based. But as best I can tell it currently is. In fact the government appears to be spending one hundred billion dollars on solar in the next six years. By 2022. Furthermore, "The Ministry of New and Renewable Energy provides 70 percent subsidy on the installation cost of a solar photovoltai…

There are very little subsidies for Wind and Solar in India. MNRCE subsidies are for specific projects. The vast majority are tenders or auctions. Developers bid a tarrif whatever they feel their Return on Assets can bear.

See here for more https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11520789

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