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Thermal camera footage allegedly shows pro cyclists using motors

fittish.deadspin.com

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Re: Thermal camera footage allegedly shows pro cyclists using motors

#121

Post by thaumasiotes »

jdietrich wrote: post #87
dclowd9901 wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If technology is integral, then why ban motors at all? Small motors and powerful compact energy supplies are technological advancements.

It's a balance between man and machine, between tradition and progress. F1 racing cars would be faster if they replaced the driver with a computer. The fans want to see the skills of the driver tested, so the sport bans common driver aids like traction control and anti-lock brakes. Cycling with motors isn't cycling, it's motorcycling. Allowing motors would change the sport in an undesirable and irrevocable manner. In…

> Technology is an intrinsic part of the sport, but it is not allowed to play a dominant role.

I can't make any sense of this. Any bicycle is 100% a product of technology. I can't think of anything that plays a more dominant role in bicycle racing than... bicycles.

Re: Thermal camera footage allegedly shows pro cyclists using motors

#122

Post by [deleted] »

paulmd wrote: post #64

Just take the bike out of the race entirely. Declare a year in advance that the bike will be XYZ model Q so people can train on them, and the race maintains custody of all race bikes, spares, etc. It's already a money-competition to see who can buy the best super-bike. Yes, you have to have a minimum weight, but that just means that you can take a superbike and spend the extra weight applying aerodynamic fairings whe…

[deleted]

Re: Thermal camera footage allegedly shows pro cyclists using motors

#124

Post by crawdog »

paulmd wrote: post #64

Just take the bike out of the race entirely. Declare a year in advance that the bike will be XYZ model Q so people can train on them, and the race maintains custody of all race bikes, spares, etc. It's already a money-competition to see who can buy the best super-bike. Yes, you have to have a minimum weight, but that just means that you can take a superbike and spend the extra weight applying aerodynamic fairings whe…

UCI already regulates weight and aero features on the bike.

The rules should change to mandate 1 bike, no swaps to keep riders from changing from a "doped" bike to a non-doped one before finishing - or provide better chain of evidence reporting on existing bikes.

There's a huge difference in weight/tech from pro/non-pro bikes. Take a look at what's available for triathlons vs. UCI time trial bikes.

Re: Thermal camera footage allegedly shows pro cyclists using motors

#125

Post by ddispaltro »

bigiain wrote: post #101
dclowd9901 wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If technology is integral, then why ban motors at all? Small motors and powerful compact energy supplies are technological advancements.

Why ban steroids? Why ban amphetamines? Whyban surgical modification? Why ban genetic engineering? Why ban motorised exo skeletons and nano technology? (I just read a great short story along these lines called ""Slipping" by Lauren Brookes - from the EFF'S PWNING TOMORROW short fiction anthology...)

You have to ban things that are outright bad for athletes. You also have to remember, given a competition people will do whatever it takes to win, because someone else will. So you have to draw the line somewhere.

Re: Thermal camera footage allegedly shows pro cyclists using motors

#126

Post by wobbleblob »

stouset wrote: post #85
benjiweber wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's quite common to switch bike with one from a support car during a stage (Due to mechanical faults or otherwise). This could make it tougher.

There's no reason the team car has to retrieve bikes swapped out.

No reason except it being a $15,000 bike, personalized and tuned? Or over $50,000 if it's fitted with one of these engines, apparently.

They're not going to trust someone else to pick it up, even if it's a completely honest bike.

Re: Thermal camera footage allegedly shows pro cyclists using motors

#127

Post by Too »

dgudkov wrote: post #52

It would be more interesting if it was legal with some reasonable limitations. It could be one more reason for boosting the battery technology.

This is interesting yeah, put an upper weight limit on the bike and see how fast and long a human can go with only 10kg of technology.

Re: Thermal camera footage allegedly shows pro cyclists using motors

#128

Post by backtoyoujim »

paulmd wrote: post #64

Just take the bike out of the race entirely. Declare a year in advance that the bike will be XYZ model Q so people can train on them, and the race maintains custody of all race bikes, spares, etc. It's already a money-competition to see who can buy the best super-bike. Yes, you have to have a minimum weight, but that just means that you can take a superbike and spend the extra weight applying aerodynamic fairings whe…

People that don't write software but use software say the same thing about operating systems.

"Why are there even more than one? It is absurd!"

Re: Thermal camera footage allegedly shows pro cyclists using motors

#129

Post by crawdog »

niels_olson wrote: post #47

Am I the only cyclist here? I can't imagine voluntarily putting batteries in my bike on a long, mountainous stage. There's no way the batteries will last, and then I'm stuck with dead weight. And, looking through the actual documentary, I didn't see any incontrovertable thermal proof of a battery in any racer. In the guy posing for a shot, yes, but not in the cyclists laboring up the hill.

With the minimum weight requirements in bikes they are having to add weight inside the frame to meet the minimum. Adding a battery + motor that provides even 20W of assist is a huge gain for a bike that still only hits the minimum weight.

Re: Thermal camera footage allegedly shows pro cyclists using motors

#130

Post by crawdog »

randlet wrote: post #18
tetraodonpuffer wrote: post #14

the thing with mechanical doping is that if you aren't caught red-handed, you are free, with doping some races/competitions will freeze your samples and they can be tested years later to find out if you were using something that wasn't testable yet, but with mechanical doping, once you're done the race you're safe. And over a course of a grand tour stage, even if the boost is only 25W, it can easily make the differen…

Seems trivial to detect now though. It's no problem to just tear down the bikes of the first X finishers to look for mechanical aids. Detecting doping reliably is much trickier. edit: I think most high level bikes use carbon fibre frames? You could probably just use x-ray or ultrasound imaging to look for anything suspicious in the frame.

Harder when pro riders may change their bike mid-stage...
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