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Smart Kids Should Skip High School

sonyaellenmann.com

61–68 of 68 posts

Re: Smart Kids Should Skip High School

#61
post #19

Is this like saying "Rich people should hoard their wealth"? There is something to be said for Smart kids being at school both receive and PROVIDE benefit to/from the other students. But I guess, who cares about dumb kids, who had less opportunity than the smart ones? They'll get a better draw next life!

Even if for the sake of argument we assume your assertion that "smart kids" benefit their classmates is correct... on what basis do you assert that those "smart kids" owe their classmates anything at all? Why are their classmates entitled to an education at their expense, and what do the "smart kids" get in return?

This is like asking "what do I get out of not robbing the old lady in the park"... You don't get anything for not doing that, and you miss out on cashing in her pension cheque.

Re: Smart Kids Should Skip High School

#62
post #26
post #19

Is this like saying "Rich people should hoard their wealth"? There is something to be said for Smart kids being at school both receive and PROVIDE benefit to/from the other students. But I guess, who cares about dumb kids, who had less opportunity than the smart ones? They'll get a better draw next life!

Actually, smart kids usually end up a net loss for classes. They get bored. so they skip classes, or end up sitting in class bothering everyone else. They also end up frustrating other kids because "why does it come so easy for X but not for me?" Bad teachers even use smart kids as examples: "See, you all should be a lot more like smart kid". A smart kid isn't going to magically become a free tutor for other kids at…

Research shows the opposite. Mixing ability levels increases the median mark. The point of public funded education is not to produce a minority of geniuses but a majority of smart people.

Re: Smart Kids Should Skip High School

#63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

because taking your time through college can be an incredible experience.

On the other hand, parent-poster's son probably saved enough money to buy a car. College credits are incredibly expensive, and if you can do them for free in high school, there's no reason to skip them. On a broader level, I would very much like to disagree with people who say that you should take your time through college. Take your time through college... if you can afford it . Don't forget that you're paying a goo…

We are ridiculously poor so money saved is a large benefit. But because he qualifies for the whole fasfa aid and since he saved a year of college he is doing a double major. So getting college units in is allowing him to do more and still be the right age getting out.

Re: Smart Kids Should Skip High School

#64
post #59
post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I went to one of the better public high schools in my district, so not one of the best schools in the country. I learned quite a bit. Both the US history and European history teachers were very good, the calculus and differential equations courses were an excellent base for college physics and applied math, the computer class marked the start of my transition from an avid hobby programmer to a software developer, and…

I did most of my learning outside of school, but I did have a few classes that I liked, all of my history teachers were very good, my chemistry and biology teachers were awesome. I appreciate those classes and I'm glad I took part in them but I don't think it made up for the rest. Perhaps we had similar experiences but we contextualize them differently. Do you think the classes you mentioned were worth everything els…

It is impossible to answer your questions. I would have had different experiences. I would have also said those different experiences were formative. Nor do I think it's useful to compare the "worth" of one life to another. Whose life is more worthy, yours, or that of one of your grandparents? Would you go to someone and say "my life is more worthy than yours"? Might your alternative self punch you in the nose for saying that?

I can, without doubt, say that I would have had a different life if my high school had been organized along the lines of a German Gymnasium school than the liberal arts tradition of the US. So of course I would have had yet a different life if I had "something other than high school".

BTW, I do not like your seemingly self-centered view. Public education doesn't exist only for my own "worth", but also for the benefit of society. Street signs, warnings, and public notices are more effective if (nearly) everyone is literate. One thread in pubic education is to develop an informed citizen. Another thread is to train workers at the public expense. A third is to keep cheap child labor from the workforce. A fourth is to indoctrinate children that the common good is a worthy goal. ;)

Nor do I think your question is a useful one, for policy or decision making purposes. "Could" is a question of a non-zero probability. Benjamin Franklin had no formal higher level education, and look what he managed. So sure, I "could" have been like Franklin and managed on my own. But the retrospective logic to answer "could" doesn't help answer the relevant policy question "would", or for the decision making at the time "should I take these classes, or CLEP out and enter college early?"

For me, it's pretty simple. I wanted to be a math professor. (I changed my mind when I was about 20.) Either I stay in high school, where I can take college-level courses for free, either as dual-enrolled or through AP test credits, and take classes that guarantee me in-state scholarship, or I get a job, ... or I enter the debt hole.

Sure, there are more options than that. My parents, close relatives, and neighbors have never been to college. We had no contacts in any of the careers that interested me. I knew no programmers other than hobbyists like myself. I didn't know any other options. Even now, knowing more, I don't know what I would have done if I decided to skip high school.

In that context, I can also imagine (without any basis in fact) that you had more options available to you. Perhaps your parents had money, or you had better connections to jobs that interested you, or didn't think that $40,000+ in school debt would be a problem.

But now we're far away from your original point, which is that you "don't remember learning much of anything" and therefore agree that "smart kids should skip high school." I disagree - I do remember leaning a lot of things. Since you say you went to a much better school than mine, you must have learned things as well, even if you've since forgotten it. You've now said that you haven't forgotten it, and attended classes. I don't know how you can say that you didn't learn anything from class. You say you didn't study, which means you have to have learned things from being in class and doing homework.

Re: Smart Kids Should Skip High School

#65
So maybe what we need are high schools where students start by learning how to devise a project and work on it. This stage will give students the skill set to do their own project while introducing them to a wide variety of concepts. In stage two, students write the question they want to answer and form a study group to work with. Stage three is completing the project and stage four is some form of publication.

Re: Smart Kids Should Skip High School

#66
post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What makes that the best thing? All available evidence suggests it is not a relevant thing at all, since home schooled children are indistinguishable in social skills to regular schooled children. The forced social experience of a typical school is very artificial, and does not apply well to many other social settings. The only real similar setting is prison. Unless the goal of school is to prepare children for the s…

> What makes that the best thing? All available evidence suggests it is not a relevant thing at all, since home schooled children are indistinguishable in social skills to regular schooled children. I, for one, very much doubt that "available evidence".

Facts don't really care if you doubt them or not. Please, answer the question. What makes that the best thing?

Re: Smart Kids Should Skip High School

#67
post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even if for the sake of argument we assume your assertion that "smart kids" benefit their classmates is correct... on what basis do you assert that those "smart kids" owe their classmates anything at all? Why are their classmates entitled to an education at their expense, and what do the "smart kids" get in return?

This is like asking "what do I get out of not robbing the old lady in the park"... You don't get anything for not doing that, and you miss out on cashing in her pension cheque.

Robbing someone is a property crime, with a threat of violence.

It's completely irrelevant to this conversation.

Re: Smart Kids Should Skip High School

#68
post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is like asking "what do I get out of not robbing the old lady in the park"... You don't get anything for not doing that, and you miss out on cashing in her pension cheque.

Robbing someone is a property crime, with a threat of violence. It's completely irrelevant to this conversation.

I see, so we have an arbitrary law around an amoral action, so it's not relevant to the discussion of amoral actions?

I don't follow the logic.

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