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Senators Kerry & Lugar Introduce the Startup Visa Act

startupvisa.com

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Re: Senators Kerry & Lugar Introduce the Startup Visa Act

#111

Post by davemc500hats »

Aegean wrote: post #103

I don't see why it is so capital-oriented. It is certainly better than nothing, but a fairer scheme would also include skills assessment. Otherwise its against the nature of entrepreneurship - venture capital is not a prerequisite to a successful startup, its only one of the helpful ingredients. On such a thing like visa where it is a yes or no situation, it shouldn't just depend on availability of venture capital.

"skills assessment" is typically a more SUB-jective metric. subjective metrics are more easily misjudged, misinterpreted, and likely more time-intensive to audit (read: subject to abuse by bureaucracy & likely to increase processing times).

raising capital, creating jobs, or making revenue are very OB-jective metrics, and are much less easily abused or compromised (read: determined easily by provable data, likely to not be interfered with or misinterpreted by bureaucrats, and likely to streamline / reduce processing times).

in other words, market data & stats are provable & will likely speed up the process.

there is nothing quite so unfair or undemocratic as an INS official who has had a bad day, is misinformed, or is behind on paperwork -- or heaven forbid all of the above.

we hope to avoid this situation by making the Startup Visa rqmts very easily objective & provable based on verifiable data.

Re: Senators Kerry & Lugar Introduce the Startup Visa Act

#112

Post by breck »

briansmith wrote: post #82
pg wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In this particular case the reason it matters is that it makes briansmith's comment false.

Why is anything I said false? Because I used the word "just"? Take out the word "just" and everything we both said is true: there are VC's that aren't rich, and rich people will be able to abuse this to get their friends green cards, while those without connections have to wait and work for 7-9 years to get their green cards. Look at http://travel.state.gov/visa/frvi/bulletin/bulletin_4659.htm... . It says that the U…

> rich people will be able to abuse this

I'm sure they will. However, rich people are such a minority that in 90%+ of cases this law will be used for its intended purpose.

Rich people can also "abuse" speeding and parking ticket laws(you can speed and park anywhere if you can afford the tickets), tax laws, etc. Just the way of the world. I wouldn't lose too much sleep over it.

Re: Senators Kerry & Lugar Introduce the Startup Visa Act

#113

Post by zmmmmm »

tptacek wrote: post #68
ajju wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn't it true that it is $1MM in revenue within 2 years of getting a visa ? So you could apply when you had $500K in revenues. Also, I don't know for sure if the qualifying clauses for not being deported have an "and" relationship or an "or" relationship. Do I need to raise a million dollars AND generate a million in revenue AND generate 5 jobs? Or is one of these enough?

If you're at 500k already, you can probably pull off an EB-5. Regardless, I'm not all that concerned about the 500k entrepreneurs. I'm unclear on the "and" and "or" thing, too, but I think it's equally arbitrary to deport someone with 4 full-time employees for missing a $1MM mark, and I think 5 "full-time" employees is extremely gameable.

> I think 5 "full-time" employees is extremely gameable

That's what strikes me. What kind of employee do they need to be? If I employ 5 full time janitors on minimum wage do I get to stay?

Re: Senators Kerry & Lugar Introduce the Startup Visa Act

#114

Post by davemc500hats »

tptacek wrote: post #53
phreanix wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quick glance and please correct me if I got this wrong: This only affects immigrants with permanent residency status who have been sponsored through this bill/law. You stated: "This is a bill that proposes to give US venture capitalists the overt ability to terminate the residency status of founders and their families." True in the sense that if the sponsored entrepreneur was unable to fulfill the job creation, capit…

I believe this bill was conceived with the best of intentions. I believe everybody advocating it, including venture capitalists, are advocating with the best of intentions. But their intentions don't matter at all . What matters is the law that the bill will create. And, as I read it, the law that this bill creates will have unintended negative consequences both for immigration and entrepreneurship. Your last sentenc…

the 3 points are an OR, not an AND. you misinterpreted it.

altho the legislation as proposed is not final, it was clearly drafted and stated with each of the 3 potential rqmts being sufficient on their own, not together.

Re: Senators Kerry & Lugar Introduce the Startup Visa Act

#115

Post by davemc500hats »

icey wrote: post #42
tptacek wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Those requirements are, in their entirety: that you are an accredited investor, and that you've made 2 $50k equity investments within the last 3 years.

Ha, okay so "strict requirements" is not the right way to describe it. To do what Max was talking about would only require $200K to get in the door, and the willingness of an accredited investor to commit fraud.

there are obvious rqmts to qualify that require time and effort in addition to capital, and a track record of investment over at least 3 years and 6 previous companies.

there are obvious penalties which would be incurred if someone intentionally abused this system.

legislation does not prevent all types of abuse, however we have attempted to reasonably make it unlikely that such abuse would not occur without great cost and risk to the perpetrators.

we believe we have done a responsible job in drafting the legislation to avoid this. exact language will depend on how the bill gets negotiated before final vote.

Re: Senators Kerry & Lugar Introduce the Startup Visa Act

#117

Post by davemc500hats »

tptacek wrote: post #5
icey wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

By "overt ability to terminate the residency status..." you mean that they can opt to not further invest, right? I couldn't see anything that gave them the ability to otherwise control the status of the visa holders; but it's possible that I missed some nuance in the bill. I think the goal is to prevent abuse of loopholes as much as possible - stopping corporations from becoming "investors" in order to circumvent the…

Yes. If you start a company that employs 5 Americans and generates $900,000 in revenue, any VC you negotiate with gets to factor "deportation" into their terms.

no, you're absolutely incorrect.

if you create 5 US jobs, you get to stay.

if you don't create 5 US jobs, but can generate EITHER $1M in revenue (at break-even or better), OR raise $1M in additional capital from ANY qualifying investor (doesn't have to be the original one), you get to stay.

please read the language carefully -- it does cover the situation adequately.

we did take quite a bit of time to consider the exact language, and worked hard to get it to be functional.

Re: Senators Kerry & Lugar Introduce the Startup Visa Act

#118

Post by davemc500hats »

tptacek wrote: post #94
alex_c wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which could be argued (by entrepreneurs looking for a startup visa) is still better than nothing. No, it's not perfect, but what alternative do you propose?

Drastically relaxing green card restrictions.

perhaps a laudable goal, however: 1) not mutually exclusive to proposed Startup Visa Act 2) politically MUCH more challenging to pull off

feel free to contribute to other efforts to promote your ideas. however, hope you don't feel the need to tear down our (complementary) ones that may be achieved practically & expediently.

light a candle, don't piss on ours.

Re: Senators Kerry & Lugar Introduce the Startup Visa Act

#119

Post by fnid2 »

ajju wrote: post #110
fnid2 wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I might not have been clear on the numbers, but I believe any such restrictions on entry are not good. I don't believe any of them should be requirements. If someone wants to come to the U.S. and try to create a business and has it all lined out -- let them come! Don't make them get approval from someone with lots of money.

If someone wants to come to the U.S. and try to create a business and has it all lined out -- let them come! Has, what all lined out? There in lies the rub. If you let anyone who declares he is an entrepreneur in, the law will be a joke. Naturally, you have to have some firm qualifiers. As long as it is 5 jobs OR a million dollars in revenue OR investment and you have 2 (or 3) years to do it, I don't understand why t…

Perhaps I should ask you then, why would you take this visa deal instead of simply having the investors give you the money for you to create your business in your home country?

Re: Senators Kerry & Lugar Introduce the Startup Visa Act

#120

Post by [deleted] »

tptacek wrote: post #2

This is a bill that proposes to give US venture capitalists the overt ability to terminate the residency status of founders and their families. Not only do you have to get sponsored by an effectively arbitrary class of financiers (it is possible that Warren Buffet wouldn't qualify under these terms, depending on whether he has personally made 2 equity investments last year), but even if your company creates 10 US job…

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