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Google's Nest is disabling some of its customers' old smart-home devices

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Re: Google's Nest is disabling some of its customers' old smart-home devices

#321
post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> when the business case no longer makes sense Doing this kills ALL future business of this type. Who would buy such a device knowing this could happen? Unless they don't plan on making consumer appliances anymore.

I don't like this at all, but I think you've got the calculus wrong. If you truly believe in IoT, then the percentage of future Alphabet customers who will ever hear about this scandal is tiny.s

Oh don't worry. I'll do my part in making sure more people hear about this.

Seriously though. Highlighting the ridiculousness of the current approach to IoT (including laughing off startups in this area that follow the SaaS/cloud model with hardware) is probably the only reasonable way of this mess.

Re: Google's Nest is disabling some of its customers' old smart-home devices

#322

Earlier quoted context omitted.

counter point: i pre-ordered dropcam for the reason that it was limited to cloud-use only. I wanted something dead simple to use so my wife / house sitter / etc could easily move it as needed, we had access anywhere without configuration, and devops/it being handled by someone else incase i'm not around. Classifying their cloud-only product design decision as "incredible arrogance" quite a stretch... if anything, sou…

"if anything, sounds like incredible ignorance on part of buyer?" I read the box. It listed a bunch of cool features. I bought it. Nowhere on the box did it say, "We will keep all of your video and there is no way for you to use this device without Dropcam.com acting as an intermediary." I'm sure if I'd read some reviews, it would have been more clear to me what I was buying. But, I've bought cameras in this category…

My expectation as a consumer of these kinds of devices was not, at all, met by what Dropcam is. I consider it unethical (particularly the misleading copy on their packaging, but the general case of a device being ransomware, as well)

Why didn't you just simply return the camera once you realized there was platform lock-in? Even after using Dropcam for significant time, the largest "investment" is the content captured during the "DVR" sliding window of 7 or 30 days--which you can export and manually download in chunks. How exactly was their product "ransomware"?

"I can't make people care about privacy, security"

FWIW, I care deeply about privacy/security, even more than some here. But how how does privacy / security relate to the service lock-in. If anything, the alternate "open" model has proven to be far worse in terms of privacy and security. I used my Dropcam to monitor the exterior of my house, pointed outward from a window. I accepted the tradeoffs, accepting the potential risk of Dropcam being hacked or a rogue engineer/admin, but trusting that they understood that risk and the need for appearing to care. Now, there's currently no consumer device on the market that I'd trust to continuously capture video in all common rooms (e.g. not bath/bed) in my house--even if only streaming to an on-prem server. The only option I'm comfortable with is building my own cameras, where I have control over the os/security/patches of the cameras.

So...we're agreed, then, that you are at their mercy. Sure, I agree that when purchasing a paired device and service offering, that you're at the mercy of that company to continue offering said service. I fully understood what I was getting when I purchased the camera, and felt that their model was worth $149. Maybe the marketing copy has changed since launch, but i fail to see how they were "unethical" or that the device is "ransomware". To be clear, I'm referring to Dropcam in 2012, not Nest.

Re: Google's Nest is disabling some of its customers' old smart-home devices

#323

I bought a Dropcam when they were a new thing. When I realized they did literally everything via a cloud service and would be a brick without that service, I was furious. The incredible arrogance of a company making a webcam that sends your video to their servers, and provides no means to use the camera in a secure/local fashion, was astonishing to me. I still can't believe something like Dropcam is such a huge succe…

Every time I see a new security hardware startup I immediately look for what their products can do without a cloud service. 9/10 the answer is: absolutely nothing. In 2-3 years it'll be in a landfill, not because the hardware is obsolete, but because the firmware made it so. Landfills full of hubris.

Landfills full of hubris.

Landfills full of unicorn poop.

Re: Google's Nest is disabling some of its customers' old smart-home devices

#324

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Good point. My Hue lights work without an internet connection, and can be controlled from a device on my local network. And they are also made by an old-school company, Phillips.

There's ups and downs to Hue. If you recall earlier they tried axing out support for third party bulbs from their app. But they also deserve some kudos for basing their app and devices on a open platform to begin with.

Yes, but once people protested, they admitted their mistake and reverted it. AFAIK their position now is that they won't go out of their way to support third party bulbs unless the manufacturer joins their "friends of Hue" program, but their hub firmware isn't blocking them and should work with other bulbs that meet certain specs.

Re: Google's Nest is disabling some of its customers' old smart-home devices

#325

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hah. Has anyone been able to uphold a "You agree to being abducted" in a terms of service before?

It's not, legally, abduction when you are in an airliner and the pilot reroutes because of a security incident; why would it be in a single passenger commercial automated vehicle?

Because you can't just safely step off of a plane? Come on, that's a terrible analogy. Taxi cabs can't suddenly re-route you to the police station against your will.
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