Mailtrain.org, self-hosted open-source Mailchimp clone • Hacker News Board

Re: Mailtrain.org, self-hosted open-source Mailchimp clone

#61

Post by madaxe_again » Tue, Apr 05, 2016, 7:59 AM UTC

WA wrote: post #59

dvfjsdhgfv wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, deliverability and being self-hosted might not go well together these days. There is a LOT you need to go in terms of setting up the relevant infrastructure; the newsletter software is just a tiny fragment of it. And even if your carefully crafted infrastructure works now, it can suddenly stop, just because some big e-mail hosting service decides they implement a major change (see e.g.: http://tanguy.ortolo.eu/…

See, I get your point, but my experience is different. All the transactional emails of my SaaS are sent out with PHP's mail() which is obviously the worst infrastructure setup you can get and only a fraction is marked as spam for my receivers. Same is true for my contact form. A copy is sent to the receiver. This works with my providers SMTP server and again, not that many problems with deliverability. In my limited…

Yeah, but you aren't pumping out 250,000 emails from that domain every day, are you?

That's where the whole deliver ability lark comes in, and is why we offload non-transactional emails to the likes of bronto and adestra. One less thing to worry about.

Re: Mailtrain.org, self-hosted open-source Mailchimp clone

#62

Post by twisted1919 » Tue, Apr 05, 2016, 8:38 AM UTC

WA wrote: post #60

slig wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wasn't clear. I mean that Mailwizz was built around a solid PHP framework [1], while Sendy is pure PHP. [1] http://www.yiiframework.com/

So what's the value add here? As a user, how does the framework matter?

It does matter a lot since it brings a solid foundation to build on, and that foundation is well tested, gets regular updates and makes it easy to create a super extensible application.

Most of users that look for such self hosted solution will know that using a framework is better than "pure php" because they get well tested code.

Re: Mailtrain.org, self-hosted open-source Mailchimp clone

#63

Post by twisted1919 » Tue, Apr 05, 2016, 8:39 AM UTC

RealGeek wrote: post #55

JacobJans wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It appears to have tons more features. Do you have any experience with it? If so, what is your use-case? Thank you!

I use Mailwizz. It lacks the polish of MailChimp, but works well. It is multi-tenant and you can have sub-accounts with their quotas. You can even use it to roll your own SaaS with the included user management and billing features.

Mailwizz is active developed and the UI is going to change at some point too ;)

Re: Mailtrain.org, self-hosted open-source Mailchimp clone

#64

Post by jazoom » Tue, Apr 05, 2016, 8:44 AM UTC

homero wrote: post #53

etjossem wrote: post #37

Another alternative: SendGrid recently released a much less expensive product [1] which shares most features with MailChimp. Contact storage costs $20 per month for a typical list of 20,000 subscribers (for comparison, storing the same number of contacts at MailChimp would be $150/mo). We handle deliverability issues ourselves, so you won't have to maintain the reputation of a self-hosted solution. If you have any qu…

I'll never use sendgrid with the horrifically complicated pricing schemes, do it like mailgun

Mailgun restricts features unless you pay more money, which increases as your plan increases. I prefer SendGrid's model. They're just different pricing models.

Re: Mailtrain.org, self-hosted open-source Mailchimp clone

#65

Post by huskyr » Tue, Apr 05, 2016, 8:47 AM UTC

WA wrote: post #59

dvfjsdhgfv wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, deliverability and being self-hosted might not go well together these days. There is a LOT you need to go in terms of setting up the relevant infrastructure; the newsletter software is just a tiny fragment of it. And even if your carefully crafted infrastructure works now, it can suddenly stop, just because some big e-mail hosting service decides they implement a major change (see e.g.: http://tanguy.ortolo.eu/…

See, I get your point, but my experience is different. All the transactional emails of my SaaS are sent out with PHP's mail() which is obviously the worst infrastructure setup you can get and only a fraction is marked as spam for my receivers. Same is true for my contact form. A copy is sent to the receiver. This works with my providers SMTP server and again, not that many problems with deliverability. In my limited…

Is there a, say, ballpark figure on the volume you need to send before switching to a SaaS becomes an interesting option? E.g., i have a newsletter with about 300 subscribers that i'd like to host somewhere else, and i don't think will ever reach more than maybe a couple of thousand readers.

Re: Mailtrain.org, self-hosted open-source Mailchimp clone

#66

Post by WA » Tue, Apr 05, 2016, 9:36 AM UTC

huskyr wrote: post #65

WA wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

See, I get your point, but my experience is different. All the transactional emails of my SaaS are sent out with PHP's mail() which is obviously the worst infrastructure setup you can get and only a fraction is marked as spam for my receivers. Same is true for my contact form. A copy is sent to the receiver. This works with my providers SMTP server and again, not that many problems with deliverability. In my limited…

Is there a, say, ballpark figure on the volume you need to send before switching to a SaaS becomes an interesting option? E.g., i have a newsletter with about 300 subscribers that i'd like to host somewhere else, and i don't think will ever reach more than maybe a couple of thousand readers.

I never thought about that. I only see that hosted newsletter software is too expensive. My requirements:

    - Send maybe 2,000 transactional emails per week
    - Send a few hundred autoresponders ("newsletters") per week
    - Once a year or so, send 70,000 emails to all users who signed up

I neither want to have an email list with 70,000 people in it where only a fraction regularly receives an email. Nor do I want to pay several hundred bucks for the occasional broadcast to the entire user base.

And also: I won't use non-German newsletter providers for privacy reasons. This is probably way too strict and kind of an illusion, but that's just how I run my business.

Re: Mailtrain.org, self-hosted open-source Mailchimp clone

#67

Post by WA » Tue, Apr 05, 2016, 9:36 AM UTC

madaxe_again wrote: post #61

WA wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

See, I get your point, but my experience is different. All the transactional emails of my SaaS are sent out with PHP's mail() which is obviously the worst infrastructure setup you can get and only a fraction is marked as spam for my receivers. Same is true for my contact form. A copy is sent to the receiver. This works with my providers SMTP server and again, not that many problems with deliverability. In my limited…

Yeah, but you aren't pumping out 250,000 emails from that domain every day, are you? That's where the whole deliver ability lark comes in, and is why we offload non-transactional emails to the likes of bronto and adestra. One less thing to worry about.

Absolutely, my numbers are way lower.

Re: Mailtrain.org, self-hosted open-source Mailchimp clone

#68

Post by gingerling » Tue, Apr 05, 2016, 10:24 AM UTC

I am the phpList community manager. Anyone used phpList before? We're Open Source (AGPL specifically).

We offer phpList as a hosted service on phpList.com. It's the same code (AGPL) but we deal with deliverability, updates etc. Our clients range from 300 mails a month (free) to high volume senders on VPS with millions of subscribers and mails :)

Re: Mailtrain.org, self-hosted open-source Mailchimp clone

#69

Post by homero » Tue, Apr 05, 2016, 11:04 AM UTC

jazoom wrote: post #64

homero wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'll never use sendgrid with the horrifically complicated pricing schemes, do it like mailgun

Mailgun restricts features unless you pay more money, which increases as your plan increases. I prefer SendGrid's model. They're just different pricing models.

No way, it's the other way around. Mailgun is free or pay per email, no restrictions. Sendgrid has convoluted plans and features.

Re: Mailtrain.org, self-hosted open-source Mailchimp clone

#70

Post by shutton » Tue, Apr 05, 2016, 11:31 AM UTC

the-dude wrote: post #26

justinator wrote: post #20

Also my Dada Mail Project is something I've been working on since 1999 . http://dadamailproject.com Self-hosted, works with Amazon SES. I have many clients that send many thousands of messages using the cheapest of Bluehost shared hosting accounts, when you also use Amazon SES as the mail service. (Things like Board of Realtors groups that post realty available to a discussion list)

Hi Justin I have known your project for a very long time now. Have you ever considered offering it as a SaaS ? Why not?

Gaggle Mail is a good SaaS group email provider http://gaggle.email/

Disclosure: I'm a dev on this.