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Turkish Citizenship Database Leaked

ibtimes.co.uk

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Re: Turkish Citizenship Database Leaked

#221

Post by germanier »

kafkaesq wrote: post #182
more_original wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interesting. In Germany this database does not even exist. Each town keeps its own data and they are not connected. I think the reason for this are the evil uses of data bases by the Gestapo during Nazi times.

In Germany this database does not even exist. That seems highly doubtful. How do the EU countries know you're a citizen, then, when you cross the border?

They look at the ID card or passport you present. They may make a record of your entry and may look up whether your ID was stolen or there is a warrant for you.

They certainly don't look up in a database whether you are a citizen. Such an EU-wide thing simply doesn't exist. Heck, even the entry and exit records are not in a common database. At the moment many borders can't even verify the government signature saved on the chip.

That's the same how other government officials determine your German citizenship in most circumstances. Only very few people go through the process of getting definitive proof of their citizenship (Staatsangehörigenausweis) in any point of their life as there is simply no reason to. This process takes quite some time, often including looking at some non-digitized paper documents archived somewhere.

Re: Turkish Citizenship Database Leaked

#222

Post by igl »

istoica wrote: post #149
ttn wrote: post #129

TR citizen here, for the last 10 years only those who are really close to AKP got the government contracts including software like this etc. for stupid amounts of money with no know-how. Therefore this is absolutely normal -at least for us-, only thing that surprised me about this leak is this got into front page of HN. Those software "companies" take millions of liras, usually for stupid CRUD stuff, develop it in li…

Not only there, in other countries in Europe too, in Romania they are prosecuting the boss of the biggest software company we have, he has to sell his paintings and artwork for not being arrested(bail). The usual opinion is that they all got rich with state contracts building stupid and expensive things that young kids would do in no time for nothing. As a government agency, of course one would not prefer to hire kid…

that sounds like bavaria to me

Re: Turkish Citizenship Database Leaked

#223

Post by germanier »

more_original wrote: post #196
kafkaesq wrote: post #182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In Germany this database does not even exist. That seems highly doubtful. How do the EU countries know you're a citizen, then, when you cross the border?

Here is a source on Wikipedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Resident_registration#Germany "Unlike common belief there is no central administration — except for foreigners (see Central Register of Foreign Nationals (Germany)) — the resident registration is run by 5283 local offices throughout Germany." For passports, I'd guess that there is a different database.

There is neither a federal passport nor ID card database. All data is saved in the same databases as the usual resident registration.

Re: Turkish Citizenship Database Leaked

#224

Post by nsajko »

halukakin wrote: post #55
nsajko wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It could positively influence bad auth practices.

Hardly so for Turkey. Important positions in Turkish bureaucracy are being filled by people who have close ties to the ruling party. I guess this is somewhat normal in many countries given that you have some appropriate filters, unfortunately such filters are diminishing every year. Just last week the prime minister announced they would hire 750k long term government employees bypassing the regular procedures and by…

It is bad that decision makers can't on their own see that change is needed, but leaks like this could change public opinion, which is what influences politicians and businesses.

Re: Turkish Citizenship Database Leaked

#225

Post by kafkaesq »

germanier wrote: post #221
kafkaesq wrote: post #182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In Germany this database does not even exist. That seems highly doubtful. How do the EU countries know you're a citizen, then, when you cross the border?

They look at the ID card or passport you present. They may make a record of your entry and may look up whether your ID was stolen or there is a warrant for you. They certainly don't look up in a database whether you are a citizen. Such an EU-wide thing simply doesn't exist. Heck, even the entry and exit records are not in a common database. At the moment many borders can't even verify the government signature saved o…

They certainly don't look up in a database whether you are a citizen.

OK, "citizen or valid resident / visa holder / having some other legitimate reason to be holding something that looks like an EU identity card", then.

Whichever -- I was just simplifying. But something tells me that something at major border crossings (e.g. hub airports) has to at least authenticate your right-of-entry -- and that your travel document isn't outright fabricated -- at least a significant portion of the time.

Again, as applies strictly to cases of persons attempting to enter the Shengen area, on the basis of possession of an EU identity card, or a similar travel document asserting current legal residency in one of the member countries. I just don't see how they can (effectively) tell whether the document hasn't been forged or revoked, without comparing against a master list.

Re: Turkish Citizenship Database Leaked

#226

Post by dragandj »

istoica wrote: post #149
ttn wrote: post #129

TR citizen here, for the last 10 years only those who are really close to AKP got the government contracts including software like this etc. for stupid amounts of money with no know-how. Therefore this is absolutely normal -at least for us-, only thing that surprised me about this leak is this got into front page of HN. Those software "companies" take millions of liras, usually for stupid CRUD stuff, develop it in li…

Not only there, in other countries in Europe too, in Romania they are prosecuting the boss of the biggest software company we have, he has to sell his paintings and artwork for not being arrested(bail). The usual opinion is that they all got rich with state contracts building stupid and expensive things that young kids would do in no time for nothing. As a government agency, of course one would not prefer to hire kid…

You are all wrong, folks. Clearly, this is Serbia.

Re: Turkish Citizenship Database Leaked

#227

Post by frostymarvelous »

istoica wrote: post #149
ttn wrote: post #129

TR citizen here, for the last 10 years only those who are really close to AKP got the government contracts including software like this etc. for stupid amounts of money with no know-how. Therefore this is absolutely normal -at least for us-, only thing that surprised me about this leak is this got into front page of HN. Those software "companies" take millions of liras, usually for stupid CRUD stuff, develop it in li…

Not only there, in other countries in Europe too, in Romania they are prosecuting the boss of the biggest software company we have, he has to sell his paintings and artwork for not being arrested(bail). The usual opinion is that they all got rich with state contracts building stupid and expensive things that young kids would do in no time for nothing. As a government agency, of course one would not prefer to hire kid…

That sounds like Ghana to me

Re: Turkish Citizenship Database Leaked

#228

Post by germanier »

kafkaesq wrote: post #225
germanier wrote: post #221

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They look at the ID card or passport you present. They may make a record of your entry and may look up whether your ID was stolen or there is a warrant for you. They certainly don't look up in a database whether you are a citizen. Such an EU-wide thing simply doesn't exist. Heck, even the entry and exit records are not in a common database. At the moment many borders can't even verify the government signature saved o…

They certainly don't look up in a database whether you are a citizen. OK, "citizen or valid resident / visa holder / having some other legitimate reason to be holding something that looks like an EU identity card", then. Whichever -- I was just simplifying. But something tells me that something at major border crossings (e.g. hub airports) has to at least authenticate your right-of-entry -- and that your travel docum…

I can assure you that they do not check for positive entry in any database when crossing into Schengen whatsoever. Usually they check if the presented document is marked stolen but even that is sometimes skipped as the database (SIS II) is rather slow. This database contains around 50 million entries which shows that it can't possible hold information on all residents.

There is neither an EU-wide database of citizens, nor of permanent residents. They do have a database of most issued short-term Schengen visa nowadays (VIS) but even that took a lot of effort to implement.

And as said, at the moment they can't even verify all electronic signatures in electronic passports but that should be fixed soon.

I'm not even sure how they would create such a database of citizens as even not the German government has a conclusive list of all citizens and I presume it's similar in other member states.

That check for the right-of-entry is done with the presented document alone. Revocations are checked against and while it's possible to forge the documents it's not easy. But yes, there are known cases of people successfully entering with forged documents.

Re: Turkish Citizenship Database Leaked

#229

Post by darkhorn »

kafkaesq wrote: post #225
germanier wrote: post #221

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They look at the ID card or passport you present. They may make a record of your entry and may look up whether your ID was stolen or there is a warrant for you. They certainly don't look up in a database whether you are a citizen. Such an EU-wide thing simply doesn't exist. Heck, even the entry and exit records are not in a common database. At the moment many borders can't even verify the government signature saved o…

They certainly don't look up in a database whether you are a citizen. OK, "citizen or valid resident / visa holder / having some other legitimate reason to be holding something that looks like an EU identity card", then. Whichever -- I was just simplifying. But something tells me that something at major border crossings (e.g. hub airports) has to at least authenticate your right-of-entry -- and that your travel docum…

I'll tell you something interesting. I crossed from Bulgaria to Turkey without presenting my ID to Bulgarian authorities. I crossed into Bulgaria by just showing my ID to Bulgarian authorities. Turkish side stores detailed records but Bulgaria is not interested where I am. They don't know wheter I'm in Bulgaria or not.

On the other hand they know my fingerprints.

Re: Turkish Citizenship Database Leaked

#230

Post by iam-TJ »

JoeAltmaier wrote: post #119
iam-TJ wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I 'time shift' each number in date of birth so neither the day, month, or year are correct. My secret key is the formula I use. For other questions I use answers that 'belong' to a friend or relative. My secret key is the formula for figuring out who that is.

I wonder how many 'bits' those secret keys have? Maybe one or two? E.g. how long to brute force those answers.

My aim isn't to guard against the answers being guessed, it is to deny the operator of the service asking those questions from gathering accurate data about me that may later be exposed.

Someone then trying to fraudulently use my identity info, or for any kind of socially engineered attack, would lose out.

E.g. calling some financial service provider and trying to get a password reset based on D.O.B, mother's maiden name, or whatever.

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