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Startups in Montréal

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Re: Startups in Montréal

#21

Post by Raphmedia »

cryptoz wrote: post #13
Raphmedia wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

(quebecers here) Not language racism but english-phobia. Everyone that I know will switch to english to help people, but they expect that the reverse will be true too. You will be expected to at least attempt French. Attempting it will be enough and people will gladly help you out.

I lived in Montreal for 6 six years, as a student and for my first job. I speak a bit of French, but not much. One day in Place Ville Marie I was getting a coffee at Starbucks. I accidentally bumped into someone in line, and I said "sorry". He snarled at me angrily and said "Get out of here, go back to Toronto". I don't think I had never been to Toronto at that point in my life. Mostly that does not happen. Mostly pe…

> There is a systematic approach where the government and the locals will make your life more expensive, more complicated and less likely to succeed unless you do fully understand French.

Sucks to say it so directly, but that's the point and people vote for exactly for that (people also vote against this, so don't put everyone in the same boat). There was abuse up to that point, so the laws are harsh now.

In our history, there was a lot of oppression agaisnt french speaking people so people are still pretty afraid. The only contact that anyone over 80 years old had with english speaking people are from oppressive boss that abused them at work. I do agree on that point that the older population can be racist, but anyone under 30 should be more understanding. https://simple.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quebec#Quiet_Revolution

Re: Startups in Montréal

#22

Post by chm »

toomim wrote: post #5

I moved to Montreal last summer and spring, after years in Seattle and Berkeley. Then I gave up and moved back to Berkeley. Pros: + Bitcoin Embassy Montreal! + Really cheap hipster life + Wonderful cheap food + Walkable city + A French culture that values living, parks, & community! + Beautiful women, and lots of them + There actually is a tech scene! Woah! + It's different Cons: - Less edgy culture. Less individual…

I'm sorry you had to go through some bad experiences. However I think you're unfairly judging the city:

Corrupt government: The fact that we talk about corruption does not mean its worse than elsewhere.

Quality of higher education: Well, you've left out the whole of French speaking universities. And what does "good" mean? Just looking at budgets, you're not comparing on equal footing: Stanford ~5.5 bn USD, Concordia Culture: Well, any way you look at it, you're comparing two very different environments. Historically extremely different, just take language as a factor, and you're also comparing arguably the most fertile region in the world in regards to computer science, with another region that has historically been deemed worth only of manual labor (pre 1960's).

And the big one, language racism:

I know literally no one who would qualify as a "language racist" in the same sense of "race racist", and I've lived here a quarter century. If you're coming to live in North America's biggest French speaking city, why are you surprised if people want to speak in French? Of course it's hard to learn, but I'd say Montreal is the best place to learn French for an English speaker, as you will not have trouble being understood anywhere.

I mean, would you find it reasonable for me to learn English if I wanted to work and live in Berkeley? Some friends of mine are moving to Italy and they have to learn functional Italian to be allowed to move (per them).

The language issue is the most annoying issue with foreigners or international students. Being in University so long I've had my share of discussions with such people, and a lot of the time the sentiment could be distilled to "I have many other things to do then learn French, maybe I'll do it when I have more free time, it's hard." To be fair, I've also met greatly motivated students who spared no expense to practice their new language. Just showing some interest/effort goes a long way...!

Come back anytime :)

Re: Startups in Montréal

#23

Post by Apocryphon »

I'm really quite surprised that Montreal lacks the same sort of rent crisis that other cities like the Bay Area (or Vancouver and to some extent Toronto) has. Apparently they've got a surplus of condos for some reason?

Re: Startups in Montréal

#24

Post by Apocryphon »

JamilD wrote: post #2

Love seeing more prominent Canadian startups. I'm always impressed when I speak to people from McGill too… they have a tech-focused culture that could rival Waterloo. Miles ahead of the University of Toronto.

How does Concordia compare to McGill? Those are the two main Anglophone universities, right?

Re: Startups in Montréal

#25

Post by jordigh »

toomim wrote: post #5

I moved to Montreal last summer and spring, after years in Seattle and Berkeley. Then I gave up and moved back to Berkeley. Pros: + Bitcoin Embassy Montreal! + Really cheap hipster life + Wonderful cheap food + Walkable city + A French culture that values living, parks, & community! + Beautiful women, and lots of them + There actually is a tech scene! Woah! + It's different Cons: - Less edgy culture. Less individual…

I find it a bit troubling that you list beautiful women as a plus of a city, as if women were a natural resource like trees or clean water.

I also don't know what you mean about Montreal not being edgy enough. There's plenty of counterculture in Montreal. Did you ever spend a lot of time in Hochelaga?

The language laws have a very good historical basis. Used to be that the bosses all spoke English and the employees all spoke French. That's the reason for the language laws, so that nobody in Montreal cannot access local jobs due to lack of French and that nobody is ever spoken down in English. Seeing how the linguistic majority is French, think of it more as affirmative action than racism. It's about levelling a historically unlevel playing field.

Re: Startups in Montréal

#26

Post by jordigh »

Apocryphon wrote: post #23

I'm really quite surprised that Montreal lacks the same sort of rent crisis that other cities like the Bay Area (or Vancouver and to some extent Toronto) has. Apparently they've got a surplus of condos for some reason?

For better or for worse, Quebec is a nation of renters. The rent laws are thus skewed in the favour of tenants. The rental board enforces the laws very strictly. Tenants can refuse rent increases and have many rights that are probably keeping prices down.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/R%C3%A9gie_du_logement

Re: Startups in Montréal

#27

Post by floopidydoopidy »

Raphmedia wrote: post #19
toomim wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quebecers are my favorite Canadians! But there is definitely language racism, especially with the language laws. Here are some examples to prove my point: On a phone call with the government to renew an ID card, my bilingual Montrealler friend messed up her French grammar. The government agent said "I cannot understand you" and hung up the phone! Made her call back and wait on hold and be more careful with her gramma…

Of course there is racism, there is racism everywhere. The difference with Québec is that the racists are racist against wealthy white people who are not use to be on that side of the medal. > So they keep a stash of French keyboards in the closet. Here, even if we are french speaking, we simply stick french stickers on things. No need to buy extra products this way ;)

'wealthy white people'

Like.. the... French Canadians?

Re: Startups in Montréal

#28

Post by chm »

Apocryphon wrote: post #23

I'm really quite surprised that Montreal lacks the same sort of rent crisis that other cities like the Bay Area (or Vancouver and to some extent Toronto) has. Apparently they've got a surplus of condos for some reason?

It's a buyers market at the moment, you can get some good deals but I still think they're overpriced. Personally looking at Laval (just north of Montreal), where there are 3 metro stations and the train. It's cheaper and I'm betting on properties to increase in value in the coming years.

However should I make more money, I'd definitely stay in Montreal. I think I'd miss walking around shopping for groceries, going to restaurants etc. I hate commuting in cars.

Re: Startups in Montréal

#29

Post by sebtoast »

Raphmedia wrote: post #19
toomim wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quebecers are my favorite Canadians! But there is definitely language racism, especially with the language laws. Here are some examples to prove my point: On a phone call with the government to renew an ID card, my bilingual Montrealler friend messed up her French grammar. The government agent said "I cannot understand you" and hung up the phone! Made her call back and wait on hold and be more careful with her gramma…

Of course there is racism, there is racism everywhere. The difference with Québec is that the racists are racist against wealthy white people who are not use to be on that side of the medal. > So they keep a stash of French keyboards in the closet. Here, even if we are french speaking, we simply stick french stickers on things. No need to buy extra products this way ;)

Stickers work too, but I'm guessing that in their case they just don't want to deal with applying stickers to a lot of keys and then removing them. We also had to put some stickers on vending and coffee machines.

We used to be audited every year but after we made a lot of progress they starting coming once every 2-3 years.

I think they started auditing after complaints, we're a manufacturing company in the suburbs with 99% French speaking employees but a lot of the stuff we had was English only. Fun fact, our parent company in Texas was careful and made sure we had French documentation/communication but French speaking office employees didn't seem to care.

Re: Startups in Montréal

#30

Post by Apocryphon »

jordigh wrote: post #26
Apocryphon wrote: post #23

I'm really quite surprised that Montreal lacks the same sort of rent crisis that other cities like the Bay Area (or Vancouver and to some extent Toronto) has. Apparently they've got a surplus of condos for some reason?

For better or for worse, Quebec is a nation of renters. The rent laws are thus skewed in the favour of tenants. The rental board enforces the laws very strictly. Tenants can refuse rent increases and have many rights that are probably keeping prices down. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/R%C3%A9gie_du_logement

Interesting. How come there isn't a large influx of people moving into the city?
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