Live data from Hacker News

Panama Papers: Mossack Fonseca leak reveals elite's tax havens

bbc.com

131–140 of 452 posts

Re: Panama Papers: Mossack Fonseca leak reveals elite's tax havens

#131

Hilarious that BBC, a broadcaster paid for by British tax payers, has a subheading in that article titled "Russian connection" describing various dealings of Russian characters who are "close associates" of Putin and an equally sordid "Iceland connection" but not even a mention of David Cameron's father's tax evading schemes listed in the documents which the people of Great Britain should be vastly more interested in…

> paid for by British tax payers,

While that is mostly true, (it's the same people obviously) I'm pretty sure the BBC isn't funded by taxes. If they were, they would be under political control. Which would be silly.

Re: Panama Papers: Mossack Fonseca leak reveals elite's tax havens

#132
post #102
post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not surprised. Last I heard, the Government was floating the idea of turning editorial control of the BBC over to a board of their own appointees: http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/mar/14/the-gua...

BBC is just trying to get ahead - by self-censoring itself. They sure showed Cameron!

> by self-censoring itself.

This is is of course an area of concern. It is sometimes referred to as cognitive capture, akin to regulatory capture. It occurs when a regulatee so strongly paints a picture of how they feel the world should work, that a regulator fails to fulfill their duties, because their lens on the world has become so distorted in favor of the regulatee's perspective.

It often flows private industry ----> govt, with private industry cognitively capturing the government.

But it can just as easily go the other way. Afterall, in the west the media/journalist industry has historically been seen as the regulator of the government, the fourth estate.

Re: Panama Papers: Mossack Fonseca leak reveals elite's tax havens

#133
post #8

Holy moly, something tells me this will blow up. Any torrent available?

exactly, not so much as a leak as a release. The presumption that the press (even 100 odd institutions) need to be gatekeepers for this inforamation is offensive. Especially since the mostly sham of an excuse of the snowden documents does not hold in this case.

Re: Panama Papers: Mossack Fonseca leak reveals elite's tax havens

#136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Governments hate leaks of all kinds. Not in the UK. Leaks and "off the record briefings" are practically official government policy. To me this looks like a rather stupid attempt to promote regime change in Russia. Putin was weakened by the low oil price, and now this has all the signs of a bizarre poli-sci undergraduate plot to push him over the edge. I'll change my mind if a list of significant British and US pols…

Per the Guardian[1]: > Six members of the House of Lords, three former Conservative MPs and dozens of donors to UK political parties have had offshore assets. I expect we'll hear more about this in coming days and weeks. I don't really understand this line of thinking. Big leak + "fancy website graphics" = vast Western conspiracy? Sounds less like insightful analysis and more like the kind of denial I'd expect from R…

The reason I'm thinking "vast Western conspiracy" is that you would think, as a common sense point, that when something like this appears Western journalists would be more interested in Western politicians first.

But apparently not. I find that strange.

I also find it strange that more people don't find it strange - because it's always been obvious to me that Putin is a completely generic oligarch crook, and I really don't understand why anyone would be surprised that he acts like one.

But here's an interesting fact - public opinion management has a long history in the West, just as it does in all other big states. It's been tracked by journalists and academics, discussed in Senate committees, and explored in books. It's a long way from being either hostile state propaganda or weirdo conspiracy nonsense.

I'm quite prepared to believe that a lot of HN readers haven't taken the time to familiarise themselves with that history, but that doesn't change the historical record.

And if absolutely no US pols are implicated in this leak, I'll continue to find that curious and strange, no matter how many downvotes I get here.

As for UK pols - we'll see exactly what that means in practice. Most people here know that Cameron's father made his money as a tax consultant to the privileged, and that our beloved Chancellor's family business never pays tax.

It would certainly be interesting, timely, and welcome if other members of the government were outed as avoiding significant sums. But until more facts appear, it's too early to tell how this will play out.

Re: Panama Papers: Mossack Fonseca leak reveals elite's tax havens

#137

Hilarious that BBC, a broadcaster paid for by British tax payers, has a subheading in that article titled "Russian connection" describing various dealings of Russian characters who are "close associates" of Putin and an equally sordid "Iceland connection" but not even a mention of David Cameron's father's tax evading schemes listed in the documents which the people of Great Britain should be vastly more interested in…

It is remarkable that this breaking story focuses on Russia, Iceland and unfriendly/anti-Western dictators (Mubarak, Gaddafi, al-Assad).

And apart from Cameron's father:

- Pamela Sharples, member of the House of Lords

- Michael Ashcroft, former Deputy Chairman of the Conservative Party and former member of the House of Lords

- Michael Mates, former Member of Parliament

And in the EU:

- Giuseppe Donaldo Nicosia, business partner of former Italian senator

- Jérôme Cahuzac, former French minister

- Konrad Mizzi, current Maltese minister

- Miguel Arias Cañete, wife of a current Spanish minister and European Commissioner

- Paweł Piskorski, former Warsaw mayor

- Stavros Papastavrou, former advisor to the current Greek Prime Minister

---

Source: ICIJ https://projects.icij.org/panama-papers/power-players/index....

Re: Panama Papers: Mossack Fonseca leak reveals elite's tax havens

#138
post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ok so they can talk about Putin's childhood friend, but not about Cameron's father?

The implication was that Putin's childhood friend is running a scheme that Putin is taking part in.

But Cameron directly benefited from his father's tax avoidance. He received several hundred thousand pounds as an inheritance from his father's estate. I'm sure he would have received less if his father had not saved money by avoiding taxes. He wasn't running the scheme, but he did directly benefit from it.

Re: Panama Papers: Mossack Fonseca leak reveals elite's tax havens

#139
post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I thought here in the west we're assured that we have freedom of press. Freedom of press does not guarantee freedom from persecution (or prosecution), so the international consortium approach is a much better guarantee for all the information actually getting out.

That's exactly what freedom of the press is supposed to mean...

Not really, freedom of press is much narrower. What you're suggesting is an ideal world where journalists are protected from the egos and reputations of powerful people who might want to retaliate against them for their reporting. There are many forms of legal retaliation that freedom of press cannot protect against. In practice, this freedom is weighed against the consequences of publishing any single piece.

Re: Panama Papers: Mossack Fonseca leak reveals elite's tax havens

#140
post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your missing the point, it's clear they this leak is planned and not someone just uploading a bunch of files. People don't seem to understand what I mean by the above^. The question is would it not be better to dump the entire data set to the public, instead of it being funnelled by reporters?

Planned by whom? To what end? Do you have any information to substantiate this claim?

I'm referencing the fact that some leaks you get the whole enchilada and it's up to you or the media to sift though.

In the case it's a leak which is being funnelled by the reporters.

Maybe this is because of legal reasons, I have no idea, but would it not be better they just dumped the whole data set onto the web?

Post reply on HN