Panama Papers: Mossack Fonseca leak reveals elite's tax havens • Hacker News Board

Re: Panama Papers: Mossack Fonseca leak reveals elite's tax havens

#51

Post by mschuster91 » Sun, Apr 03, 2016, 7:36 PM UTC

mladenkovacevic wrote: post #29

Hilarious that BBC, a broadcaster paid for by British tax payers, has a subheading in that article titled "Russian connection" describing various dealings of Russian characters who are "close associates" of Putin and an equally sordid "Iceland connection" but not even a mention of David Cameron's father's tax evading schemes listed in the documents which the people of Great Britain should be vastly more interested in…

Which is why it's good that this massive pile of data is analyzed by a huge load of international newspapers.

This way, papers can selectively publish stuff that won't put themselves in too grave danger - just look what happened to The Guardian with the Snowden leak (visits from three-letter agency officials) or what happens in Turkey, Ukraine or Hungary with media that dares to publish stuff too offensive to the respective regimes.

The situation sucks, yes, but it's the only viable modus operandi for now.

Re: Panama Papers: Mossack Fonseca leak reveals elite's tax havens

#52

Post by mladenkovacevic » Sun, Apr 03, 2016, 7:42 PM UTC

sievebrain wrote: post #50

mladenkovacevic wrote: post #29

Hilarious that BBC, a broadcaster paid for by British tax payers, has a subheading in that article titled "Russian connection" describing various dealings of Russian characters who are "close associates" of Putin and an equally sordid "Iceland connection" but not even a mention of David Cameron's father's tax evading schemes listed in the documents which the people of Great Britain should be vastly more interested in…

Maybe, but "father of a PM" is not even close to the same thing as "PM". If Cameron's father has done something wrong, that doesn't (shouldn't) affect perceptions of his son. The days of punishing children for the crimes of their parents are long in the past. Assuming the guy did anything wrong, of course. As these articles note, off shore companies are not illegal.

A father is certainly a closer connection than childhood friend or "close associate" whatever that means.

Re: Panama Papers: Mossack Fonseca leak reveals elite's tax havens

#53

Post by usaphp » Sun, Apr 03, 2016, 7:43 PM UTC

sievebrain wrote: post #50

mladenkovacevic wrote: post #29

Hilarious that BBC, a broadcaster paid for by British tax payers, has a subheading in that article titled "Russian connection" describing various dealings of Russian characters who are "close associates" of Putin and an equally sordid "Iceland connection" but not even a mention of David Cameron's father's tax evading schemes listed in the documents which the people of Great Britain should be vastly more interested in…

Maybe, but "father of a PM" is not even close to the same thing as "PM". If Cameron's father has done something wrong, that doesn't (shouldn't) affect perceptions of his son. The days of punishing children for the crimes of their parents are long in the past. Assuming the guy did anything wrong, of course. As these articles note, off shore companies are not illegal.

Ok so they can talk about Putin's childhood friend, but not about Cameron's father?

Re: Panama Papers: Mossack Fonseca leak reveals elite's tax havens

#54

Post by cm3 » Sun, Apr 03, 2016, 7:44 PM UTC

lumberjack wrote: post #34

cm3 wrote: post #17

Once tax havens and double dutch schemes are unavailable to legally operating businesses, we can be very hopeful that instead of accumulating digits in a bank account, companies like Apple and Google will be forced to spend like the rest of the economy does. Spending is what's keeping the lights on generally speaking, so allowing some wealthy companies to just sit and mountains of wealth benefits nobody. Of course th…

>companies like Apple and Google will be forced to spend like the rest of the economy does Spending on what? I think one big problem here is that the capital is possessed by entities that were nurtured in very specific markets. Take Apple. They are really nothing more than a "shiny gadgets/personal computing" company. They have a ton of potential to invest in other markets but they do not have the expertise to do so.…

One major spending they could do is bringing back more production to the US and thereby increasing the locally available know-how. Right now more and more production skills are only available outside the some companies' hq countries. Apple is a good example due to the high prices their customers are willing to pay.

Re: Panama Papers: Mossack Fonseca leak reveals elite's tax havens

#55

Post by zavi » Sun, Apr 03, 2016, 7:45 PM UTC

cm3 wrote: post #17

Once tax havens and double dutch schemes are unavailable to legally operating businesses, we can be very hopeful that instead of accumulating digits in a bank account, companies like Apple and Google will be forced to spend like the rest of the economy does. Spending is what's keeping the lights on generally speaking, so allowing some wealthy companies to just sit and mountains of wealth benefits nobody. Of course th…

These papers have nothing to do with Google or Apple.

Re: Panama Papers: Mossack Fonseca leak reveals elite's tax havens

#56

Post by cm3 » Sun, Apr 03, 2016, 7:46 PM UTC

snitko wrote: post #47

lumberjack wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>companies like Apple and Google will be forced to spend like the rest of the economy does Spending on what? I think one big problem here is that the capital is possessed by entities that were nurtured in very specific markets. Take Apple. They are really nothing more than a "shiny gadgets/personal computing" company. They have a ton of potential to invest in other markets but they do not have the expertise to do so.…

Spending is only good if it is wise. If you tell a company "sorry, you have to spend it now" it is equivalent of telling you "sorry, I don't care if you don't like any house on the market now, you'll have to buy now, you can't wait". That's no freedom, but slavery. Only when you have a choice of hoarding vs spending, then you help the economy to truly grow by providing everyone with the best products and services. In…

At least in my post I said "incentivize" and not "punish" or anything to the same extent.

One big issue is with their shareholders whose mindset may not allow increased spending and less dead digital cash.

Re: Panama Papers: Mossack Fonseca leak reveals elite's tax havens

#57

Post by cm3 » Sun, Apr 03, 2016, 7:47 PM UTC

jsprogrammer wrote: post #46

justincormack wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Return the money to shareholders who can spend or invest it.

Or, to the employees who made it, whom can spend or invest it.

And that way making the economy stronger and more dynamic. Money isn't worth anything if everybody would just hold onto it in some ledger.

Re: Panama Papers: Mossack Fonseca leak reveals elite's tax havens

#58

Post by tomp » Sun, Apr 03, 2016, 7:47 PM UTC

Jerry2 wrote: post #49

mladenkovacevic wrote: post #29

Hilarious that BBC, a broadcaster paid for by British tax payers, has a subheading in that article titled "Russian connection" describing various dealings of Russian characters who are "close associates" of Putin and an equally sordid "Iceland connection" but not even a mention of David Cameron's father's tax evading schemes listed in the documents which the people of Great Britain should be vastly more interested in…

Both the British and (especially) German [0] media are virulently anti-Russian. They blame Russians for all of their ills. Societal problems? Blame Russians. Anything that happens in their countries, they manage to find an angle to blame it on Russians somehow. Norway [1] & Sweden are also under a constant paranoia that Russians are just days away from invading them. But nothing compares to German media when it comes…

I don't know why you were downvoted, but I completely agree with you. It's great that the Panama Papers were leaked, but blaming it all on Putin seems very convenient.

Re: Panama Papers: Mossack Fonseca leak reveals elite's tax havens

#59

Post by Hermel » Sun, Apr 03, 2016, 7:48 PM UTC

Jerry2 wrote: post #49

mladenkovacevic wrote: post #29

Hilarious that BBC, a broadcaster paid for by British tax payers, has a subheading in that article titled "Russian connection" describing various dealings of Russian characters who are "close associates" of Putin and an equally sordid "Iceland connection" but not even a mention of David Cameron's father's tax evading schemes listed in the documents which the people of Great Britain should be vastly more interested in…

Both the British and (especially) German [0] media are virulently anti-Russian. They blame Russians for all of their ills. Societal problems? Blame Russians. Anything that happens in their countries, they manage to find an angle to blame it on Russians somehow. Norway [1] & Sweden are also under a constant paranoia that Russians are just days away from invading them. But nothing compares to German media when it comes…

As a regular reader of German news, this does not seem true to me. My impression is that the German media are more Russia-friendly than their British and American counterparts. After all, Russia and Germany could be natural allies from a geostrategic perspective.

Re: Panama Papers: Mossack Fonseca leak reveals elite's tax havens

#60

Post by cm3 » Sun, Apr 03, 2016, 7:48 PM UTC

zavi wrote: post #55

cm3 wrote: post #17

Once tax havens and double dutch schemes are unavailable to legally operating businesses, we can be very hopeful that instead of accumulating digits in a bank account, companies like Apple and Google will be forced to spend like the rest of the economy does. Spending is what's keeping the lights on generally speaking, so allowing some wealthy companies to just sit and mountains of wealth benefits nobody. Of course th…

These papers have nothing to do with Google or Apple.

They may not, and I didn't say they do. The tax haven and money hiding aspect reminded me that so much money just sits in a ledger digitally somewhere without benefiting anybody but the well-feeling of shareholders. A stronger economy due to more spending will also benefit shareholders.