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The James Webb Telescope, the largest science project in US government history

arstechnica.com

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Re: The James Webb Telescope, the largest science project in US government history

#41

Post by dalke »

basch wrote: post #22
leephillips wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it might have been better if the "largest" claim had not wound up part of the title, because it's led to a great deal of distracted quibbling. NASA claims that the Webb is its largest-ever science project, and others have judged it to be the largest in US history. If it's important, we can note that the Manhattan project was military, not science, although of course plenty of science was done there. Apollo mi…

Manhattan wasnt one project any more than Apollo was and most of the money went to Uranium enrichment. http://blog.nuclearsecrecy.com/2013/05/17/the-price-of-the-m...

The page you linked to says:

> Another way to look at this is to say that we usually talk about the atomic bomb as project focused on scientific research. But one could arguably say that it was more a project of industrial production instead.

I emphasized the "a project of industrial production" to show that your own reference says that it is "one project", and it refers to the entire Manhattan project as a single project, and not multiple projects as you seem to argue.

Re: The James Webb Telescope, the largest science project in US government history

#43

Post by maxxxxx »

rootbear wrote: post #34

I work at NASA Goddard where JWST is being assembled and by coincidence I went over to look at it today and take a picture. Looking at it from the observation area, I am once again reminded how enormous this thing is! Getting a look at something like this can help restore one's perspective, when one is having a bad day, and be reminded of the amazing things that are done here. I am not attached to JWST but the group…

Are the people working on this stressed out? I couldn't imagine working for years/decades on a super complex billion dollar device where you have only one try to get it right.

Re: The James Webb Telescope, the largest science project in US government history

#44

Post by rootbear »

topspin wrote: post #40
rootbear wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All of NASA will be on sedatives until this thing unfolds itself successfully. It's even more scary than the Curiosity sky crane landing system.

JWST seems like too much for NASA given the record. Galileo's high-gain antenna deployment failure, Hubble optics flaws, numerous near fatal problems with GP-B, MCO burning up... all of these and more speak to NASA's track record with complex space observatories. At L2 JWST will be beyond the reach of astronauts at the time it's launched, so all this stuff; cryocoolers, folded sunshield, folded reflector, etc. have t…

I don't think it's possible to do the science they want JWST to do unless you get out to L2 or beyond. They are basically measuring heat, and Earth puts out a lot of that. And they want to be in an orbit that doesn't pass into shadow, for reasons of solar power. I understand, and somewhat share, your concerns, but JWST is designed the way it is because that's how it has to be done to accomplish its goals.

Re: The James Webb Telescope, the largest science project in US government history

#45

Post by rootbear »

grinich wrote: post #37
rootbear wrote: post #34

I work at NASA Goddard where JWST is being assembled and by coincidence I went over to look at it today and take a picture. Looking at it from the observation area, I am once again reminded how enormous this thing is! Getting a look at something like this can help restore one's perspective, when one is having a bad day, and be reminded of the amazing things that are done here. I am not attached to JWST but the group…

Can you share that photo? And also who would I ask about getting a tour? ;)

I'm not sure if this works, but let's try:

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10207140470964842&se...

Re: The James Webb Telescope, the largest science project in US government history

#46

Post by leephillips »

rootbear wrote: post #45
grinich wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you share that photo? And also who would I ask about getting a tour? ;)

I'm not sure if this works, but let's try: https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10207140470964842&se...

Worked for me! Thanks!

Re: The James Webb Telescope, the largest science project in US government history

#47

Post by basch »

dalke wrote: post #41
basch wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Manhattan wasnt one project any more than Apollo was and most of the money went to Uranium enrichment. http://blog.nuclearsecrecy.com/2013/05/17/the-price-of-the-m...

The page you linked to says: > Another way to look at this is to say that we usually talk about the atomic bomb as project focused on scientific research. But one could arguably say that it was more a project of industrial production instead. I emphasized the "a project of industrial production" to show that your own reference says that it is "one project", and it refers to the entire Manhattan project as a single pr…

i tried to edit my comment to point that out, i ran out of time.

i was somewhat agreeing with you except classifying it as industrial building construction instead of defense.

Re: The James Webb Telescope, the largest science project in US government history

#48

Post by aylons »

noselasd wrote: post #15
aylons wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Audio signals may - and usually are - represented by EM waves. Do not confuse "audio signals" with "acoustic signals". The diagram is not only easy to understand, but also technically correct.

The same image appears on https://simple.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electromagnetic_spectrum with the text: "NOTE: The AUDIO entry in this graphic is there for comparison only. Sound waves and light are two different things entirely." Imo still somewhat confusing. I've never heard anyone refer to something on the EM spectrum as audio before.

You went to the simple image wikipedia just to find a citation that agrees with you, while the english Wikipedia has a whole artcicle describing it in quite an opposite way: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Audio_signal

If it is confusing, is because you do not understand what a "signal" means. A signal is not the phenomenon itself, it is a representation of it.

An audio signal is a signal that represents sound, but it is not sound itself. If it were, you would not need to call it a signal, it would be simply "sound". In a slightly different use of adjective, an acoustic signal is a signal (that may or not be audio, eg, ultrassound) that is carried by sound waves.

Actually, it only gets confusing if you try to be pedantic, as GP did. Everyone knows what an audio signal in a EM chart.

Re: The James Webb Telescope, the largest science project in US government history

#49

Post by aylons »

hanoz wrote: post #39
aylons wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Audio signals may - and usually are - represented by EM waves. Do not confuse "audio signals" with "acoustic signals". The diagram is not only easy to understand, but also technically correct.

> The diagram is not only easy to understand, but also technically correct. It's not easy to understand and I still don't understand it. What is audio doing on this diagram?

Audio is a name for signals that represent sound waves humans can hear. As we are only sensitive to sound in some frequencies, there is a range of frequencies in which audio signals may exist.

This diagram shows it, probably as a more mundane reference for scale.

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