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My dad hid his depression. I won’t hide mine

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Re: My dad hid his depression. I won’t hide mine

#141
A lot of these posts seem to glover over the burden that depression is. To everyone, not just the sufferer. I say that as someone who suffers from severe depression, and cares for someone who I honestly believe is dead when I don't hear from them for a week. It's not a glamorous thing (That we all agree on). It is a horrible disease, with no completely effective cure. It can strike multiple times, and has a mortality rate in the double digits. People should not feel the need to keep quiet. But people should be aware of that difficulty in dealing with depressed people. I am not saying they've done anything wrong. Dementia is horrible care-givers. The person is so frustrating, but it's not their fault.

Depression is an uncomfortable companion for me. I've suffered with it for a long time. I was first diagnosed when I was 20, but the consensus (from my obviously fallible memory) is that it began between 12-14. I still have memories of sitting in my room, singing a song about how no-one loves me, when I was 10. I am "only" 28 now. I remember feeling confused. I knew mum and dad loved me; but why did I feel like no-one did? It took me a long time, to overcome that disconnect. It's maddening. To know, intellectually, that something is true, but your mind screams at you that it's not.

My mum was diagnosed as being depressed at the age of 25. Was an alcoholic since the age of 17. She still has it. For her, there is no end in site. She's had ECT several years ago. It helped, mildly, with the depression. She was never the same after, and had severe memory problems for a year.

She has cut herself hundreds of times. She is ashamed of it, and doesn't go outside. She does it because she just wants some expression of how bad she feels on the inside. A release, an outlet. She takes 5-6 different anti-depressants, and anti-anxiety medications. She has tried to kill herself 3 times. Each time I've saved her life. The first two, she had cut her wrists open. The last time, she overdosed on her medication with rum. The last time was the time she almost succeeded.

I haven't heard from her in two weeks. Which worries me, because it is Easter, and she hasn't answered all day. No-one else in my family looks out for her. She did a lot of shit wrong, as a mother, and as a partner. But I know she is struggling. I'd check up on her physically, but she moved into new government housing, and didn't give me the address, because she was upset that I called an ambulance the last three times she cut herself, and didn't want "the drama of dealing with it again". I tell her things will get better, but I honestly don't believe they will. I want them too. I hope they do. I try to help as much as I can. But it's hard to see things getting much better.

It scares me, because I don't want that future. My marriage failed at 24. Three friends, my parents, and my sister. Those are the only people I've ever told. Way after the fact. To this day, they all believe I became depressed after the marriage. It makes sense after all.

The truth is, that I was depressed before I met my then-wife. I used to cry myself to sleep a lot. I used to feel angry a lot. Tired a lot. But for me, it was "just life". I just thought that's how things were. It wasn't until I saw the pain it inflicted on my partner that I sought help. There's a lot of reasons I am this way, supposedly. Rough upbringing. Bullying, social isolation, broken marriage of my parents, etc.

My partner found it extremely hard to deal with my need for approval, for reassurance, to be told I was loved. I eventually got help. She was hostile at first; she thought the psychologist would blame her. Three months of therapy, and things got a bit better.

After the relationship began to break down, my depression and anxiety went absolutely nuclear. Not just sad little moments at home, or a tear here and there. I would be at work, and start crying, and need to run the toilet to hide. I would have "episodes". I would just lie on the floor, curled up, sobbing. Sometimes, if the emotional pain was too much, it was this kind of horrible combination of screaming, and sobbing.

I normally have a pretty good memory of my internal monologue. When I have those episodes, there isn't any sense of self. I "remember" my wife kneeling there, holding me, and moving her mouth, with a strange look on her face. I still don't know why I was in so much emotional pain that I screamed, and screamed, and screamed.

I managed to get in check, with some anti-depressants, and psychology appointments three times a week. I think I was worse. I was so numb. Nothing was real. Work. Home. Sleep. Cry. Argue. Like some kind of strange, opaque opaque film, representing my life.

That's when I decided I would kill myself. I still loved my wife dearly, but I knew we wouldn't work. I knew she wouldn't leave me while I was in such a bad way. I acted like I was normal, and told her I just didn't love her anymore. I told her we needed some space. I promised myself I'd do it when she was far enough removed that she would feel no guilt. I told myself I'd keep the therapy up, but that was always there. Like a goal.

I actually lost 50kg, from exercising. I was running 10-15km an evening on weeknights, and 25km every Saturday. I was going to the gym four nights a week. My diet was better, the house was less of a mess. I was more in touch with my feelings.

Re: My dad hid his depression. I won’t hide mine

#142

A lot of these posts seem to glover over the burden that depression is. To everyone, not just the sufferer. I say that as someone who suffers from severe depression, and cares for someone who I honestly believe is dead when I don't hear from them for a week. It's not a glamorous thing (That we all agree on). It is a horrible disease, with no completely effective cure. It can strike multiple times, and has a mortality…

But it didn't help. I still wanted to die. I was so tired. This next statement really sums up what depression has been for me; but no-one seems to "get" it.

Getting out of bed, and putting on my pants, was harder than running a half marathon. In a very literal sense. It felt like I was overcoming physical burdens to just function. Routine helped, but I've never "tried" so hard.

Emotionally, I was so numb. I got a huge promotion at work. I did not care. My great grandfather died. I did not care. A horrible thing to say, but I had lost the capacity, 90% of the time, to feel meaningful emotions. They were the only things I missed. But when I had them, they were torment.

I would lie on the floor, crying. For four, maybe five hours each time. But I yearned for that pain, because I felt alive. Ironic, that I wanted to be alive until I died. I was still seeing a psychologist, but was not on medication. I was always honest with her, except for "the plan".

I began to drink a lot. I think I hoped I'd get drunk enough to have the courage to do it right. Death is still intimidating for me, even when I want it. It didn't help though. I'd drink 30 or 40 standard drinks, and waste the day in the shower covered in vomit. I never got to the point I would be while drunk, so I would just do it sober. I gave it up.

I took a "goodbye trip". To see family and friends. It was the first time they ever knew something was up. But to them, it was so subtle. Just a quietness of character. A dimming of the bulb.

Through coincidence, I was back home on a flight on New Years Eve. I was so certain I'd do it. No plans for elaborate, painless, ways. Just in the shower, with a kitchen knife and warm water. Hard to mess up too badly, since no-one would come looking for weeks.

I wrote my letter. I apologised. I asked if people could one day forgive me. I told them it's not their fault. Got naked, got in the shower, and I had just begun to cut myself, only shallow, when my phone rang with my dads call tone. I'm not sure why, but my determination went to dust. I thought of him, and the pain it would hurt. I told myself, I'd try even harder. I would do anything short of ECT. I'd go to hospital. I'd take medication. Anything.

My psychologist was going to have me hospitalised, but she said she trusted me, and was giving me a chance, referred me on to a prominent psychiatrist. She was against drugs too, but thought I wouldn't get better without them.

I fought for a year and a half. I went through a number of drugs, of different classes. One looked promising, but the affects went away at lower doses, and I was hyper aggressive at the higher dose. Eventually though, escitalopram "worked" best. But I started to feel again. My anxiety slowly got better.

I remember the first time I actually felt "hope". I felt like God. Invincible. Indestructible. How could I fail with hope? The drug made me "physically" tired. I had to take a dump every 3 hours. I put on a few kg. But motivation wise, it made up for it.

I got out of it... I thought. Looking back, I told myself I would never become like that again. Sound plan...

I met a new lover. She was a pretty nice girl. Didn't work out. Unfortunately, she said and did some really terrible things at the end. The break-up was a bit messy, but not extreme. A series of events really triggered off my anxiety. I lost 5kg in a week because I wasn't eating and stopped running. I stopped talking to people. I couldn't sleep more than two hours a night, on a good night. I started getting mouth ulcers.

Then came the inevitable old friend. A lot of my friends who I had told the first time around, have started getting concerned. It puts burden on them. It is not something they can just "know about and forget". They make a lot of effort too, which makes me feel bad, because I just don't care enough a lot of the time.

I saw myself slipping into a nuclear episode again. I've tried to stave it off. I'm looking for a new doctor, since I've moved since the previous event. I'm making myself eat more. I'm making myself talk to people. I'm going to the gym and running. I'm practicing and applying the techniques I learned in ACT therapy (And CBT to a lesser extent).

I'm not sure at this stage if I've stopped it. It's too early to tell. I feel like I'm on the edge of the abyss. It's easy to say it will be ok from the edge. It's a different world when you're in it.

I've spoken to my sister. To my dad. To friends. For help, for support. Because I know it's the personally responsible thing to do. But the burden on them is huge. How guilty would anyone feel, or responsible, if someone decided to give up on life, despite someone coming to them for help? Cognitively they would understand, but emotionally it's very different.

Re: My dad hid his depression. I won’t hide mine

#143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can relate. I went on a fitness binge a bit back. These days I can run a 10k in 45 minutes pretty easily, hit very good lifts for my weight class, and eat salads basically every single meal. After work and after the gym, all I want to do is drink or anything similar to get rid of all the thoughts in my head about how pointless it all is. Why the hell do I care if I can do all that crap. I feel like how others do. I…

Do you hate what you do for work? Kudos on being able to accomplish all the fitness goals under the circumstances, fwiw.

No, I actually somewhat enjoy it. I do wish it was a bit more technically challenging, but really, if I didn't work as much as I did and at the very least took a bit of enjoyment out of it, I probably would have killed myself last year. It's the only lifeline I have.

Re: My dad hid his depression. I won’t hide mine

#144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can relate. I went on a fitness binge a bit back. These days I can run a 10k in 45 minutes pretty easily, hit very good lifts for my weight class, and eat salads basically every single meal. After work and after the gym, all I want to do is drink or anything similar to get rid of all the thoughts in my head about how pointless it all is. Why the hell do I care if I can do all that crap. I feel like how others do. I…

Are you curious about anything? Travel, girls, sports? Could you put yourself in a new environment to renew some curiosity?

Tried out travel. Went to about a half dozen countries. Didn't do it for me. Everywhere is pretty much the same. People trying to live their day to day lives with minor difference in culture. Meh.

I'm terrible with people in general. I'm generally a huge bummer to be around and people don't really interest me too much.

Sports are boring as hell to me. I used to play tons of soccer, but I don't quite enjoy it all that often. Tried hiking and mountain climbing and never really enjoyed it. Even after dozen hour hikes, mostly just got a dull sense of meh.

Re: My dad hid his depression. I won’t hide mine

#145
post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What is there to explain? From your post it looks like exercise can have positive effects on depression. I haven't read anywhere here that it's the only solution. But it's sometimes as effective as other known treatments (according to your own link) and it's cheap and easy to implement. Anti-depressants and therapy don't work for everyone, either. There are people in this thread crying for help. They are looking for…

> Anti-depressants and therapy don't work for everyone, either. No, they don't. But they are more likely to work than exercise, and they're easier to try than exercise. The problem with recommending exercise is that it's not effective for most people, and can increase feelings of hopelessness and despair in people who try it but who see no effect. This makes it harder for them to seek help from a qualified profession…

A reasonable person will not hear the suggestion "try exercise" and infer that since "drink water" was not mentioned, that they ought to stop drinking water.

Unless you have some weird heart condition, or are attached to an IV pole, or are not subject to the laws of gravity and therefore are in danger of floating off into space should you leave your apartment, exercise will probably not hurt you, and may possibly create a positive change in your circumstances, whatever they happen to be[1].

[1] I trust the majority of HN readers to figure out when disclaimers apply.

Re: My dad hid his depression. I won’t hide mine

#147

A lot of these posts seem to glover over the burden that depression is. To everyone, not just the sufferer. I say that as someone who suffers from severe depression, and cares for someone who I honestly believe is dead when I don't hear from them for a week. It's not a glamorous thing (That we all agree on). It is a horrible disease, with no completely effective cure. It can strike multiple times, and has a mortality…

But it didn't help. I still wanted to die. I was so tired. This next statement really sums up what depression has been for me; but no-one seems to "get" it. Getting out of bed, and putting on my pants, was harder than running a half marathon. In a very literal sense. It felt like I was overcoming physical burdens to just function. Routine helped, but I've never "tried" so hard. Emotionally, I was so numb. I got a hug…

Nobody else commented, so I just wanted to say thanks for your story.

Re: My dad hid his depression. I won’t hide mine

#148
post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't recommend giving this advice to people who are seriously depressed. Speaking as someone who went through that for two years, it's more of a disease than a lifestyle problem. I could have done all these things and still have been miserably depressed. What helped me was talk therapy, medication (the biggest factor), and having really supportive friends.

What is the process of talk therapy? Isn't it just asking questions? Did I actually give any advice there? For sure friends are best. But if someone vents online, how are we to know whether this person will go elsewhere or not for support? I'm not offering to take the place of a professional but I wonder if it really hurts to converse with a depressed person online by asking questions. Silence certainly isn't helpful…

> Isn't it just asking questions?

Not really. It's really easy to find out how, for example, cognitive behavioural therapy works, and it's not about asking

Counselling is just talking (or perhaps "active listening") but the evidence shows that counselling is pretty terrible as a treatment for depression.

Re: My dad hid his depression. I won’t hide mine

#149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you curious about anything? Travel, girls, sports? Could you put yourself in a new environment to renew some curiosity?

Tried out travel. Went to about a half dozen countries. Didn't do it for me. Everywhere is pretty much the same. People trying to live their day to day lives with minor difference in culture. Meh. I'm terrible with people in general. I'm generally a huge bummer to be around and people don't really interest me too much. Sports are boring as hell to me. I used to play tons of soccer, but I don't quite enjoy it all that…

Fair enough. Can I just say, you don't know for certain you're a huge bummer to all others. That is just your perspective. There are people who enjoy being around people who others consider a huge bummer.

I get that you don't like being around people yourself. But I know there are some who'd enjoy your company despite your own feeling. I don't have a magic solution for how to find such friends.

My only other suggestion, aside from speaking to a therapist, would be trying meditation. Taking a few deep breaths in a quiet space, sitting in a relaxed but upright position, and trying hard to think about nothing, or only your breath, for 20 minutes, can do wonders. It is harder than it sounds and can open your mind to a lot of possibilities that previously seemed impossible. I recommend the book Mindfulness in Plain English if you're interested to learn more. It's free and available online. You're as valuable as any other person on this planet. We're all equals. Once you believe that, you can do anything you set your mind to.

Re: My dad hid his depression. I won’t hide mine

#150
post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Anecdote of one: Looking back, I've been depressed most of my adult life, from 20 to my current 58. A few years ago I went to CrossFit for a couple years. I went from not being able to do a single pullup, to being able to crack off 20+. It didn't help. For me. I still wanted to kill myself, and all the while I went to the gym I felt it was pointless. Again, that's an anecdote of one. The cause of my depression and so…

I can relate. I went on a fitness binge a bit back. These days I can run a 10k in 45 minutes pretty easily, hit very good lifts for my weight class, and eat salads basically every single meal. After work and after the gym, all I want to do is drink or anything similar to get rid of all the thoughts in my head about how pointless it all is. Why the hell do I care if I can do all that crap. I feel like how others do. I…

Yeah, this is how most things felt for me. Why do I care? And then I'd look at other people enjoying their lives, doing things they do, things that I do too, and wonder WTF? What's wrong with me?

For me, with treatment, I've gained back the capacity to enjoy life. I've gained myself back. It's not happy pills and shining eyes, it's just me, still with my individual qualities and quirks, who's been in there all these decades.

I hope you get help. It's hard to think that help is worthwhile, when everything else seems pointless. But it's worth talking to your doctor or other professional, and it's worth continuing to try if the first methods don't work. You are in there somewhere.

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