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The Chrome Distortion: how Chrome negatively alters our expectations

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Re: The Chrome Distortion: how Chrome negatively alters our expectations

#81
post #6
post #4

Does anyone have a reliable place for browser javascript benchmarks? Some searching only brought up a range of promotional type stuff from browser makers and old articles. Thanks!

https://arewefastyet.com/#machine=29 has most popular benchmarks across most JavaScript eninges on multiple platforms Edit: actually this view is probably better for people who don't care about JavaScript engine internals: https://arewefastyet.com/#machine=31

The focus on JS benchmarks is becoming ludicrous. By far the biggest performance issue is DOM/CSS layout. JS is so fast on all browsers that the performance differences don't matter at all anymore, except for initial load (and if you're loading that much code on initial page load, you should re-evaluate your architecture).

Re: The Chrome Distortion: how Chrome negatively alters our expectations

#82

I've always liked this article by one of Stripe's interface designers: https://medium.com/@bdc/chrome-is-the-new-ie-1a21c1efc133#.3... >Chrome is unfortunately contributing to the web’s bad reputation by caring more about developers than end-users. Mobile Safari can easily handle, say, a Photos.app-like interface with a translucent navigation bar, native-like swipe gestures and smooth animations. Chrome handles none…

I'm a Windows user, and one thing I dislike about Chrome on Windows is the text rendering. Here is a screenshot of some text from the Google Play store rendered in IE, Firefox and Chrome. Click the image to see it in its full size: http://imgur.com/yYKSNBB Firefox looks the best to me; Chrome the worst. IE is not great either, but it is better at larger font sizes than Chrome (IMO). You might argue that the differenc…

I have a CRT monitor, and Windows 8 font rendering is overall TERRIBLE on it, as in, heavily aliased AND full of colour fringes.

So I installed MacType, only to find that Chrome has two ways to render fonts, and both are extremely wonky, I spent like 30 minutes tweaking MacType to my tastes, and then 3 hours re-tweaking it to make Chrome behave properly, it was a serious pain.

Re: The Chrome Distortion: how Chrome negatively alters our expectations

#83

I've always liked this article by one of Stripe's interface designers: https://medium.com/@bdc/chrome-is-the-new-ie-1a21c1efc133#.3... >Chrome is unfortunately contributing to the web’s bad reputation by caring more about developers than end-users. Mobile Safari can easily handle, say, a Photos.app-like interface with a translucent navigation bar, native-like swipe gestures and smooth animations. Chrome handles none…

I'm a Windows user, and one thing I dislike about Chrome on Windows is the text rendering. Here is a screenshot of some text from the Google Play store rendered in IE, Firefox and Chrome. Click the image to see it in its full size: http://imgur.com/yYKSNBB Firefox looks the best to me; Chrome the worst. IE is not great either, but it is better at larger font sizes than Chrome (IMO). You might argue that the differenc…

Windows has had a weird font rendering subsystem transition since OpenType and some of the subpixel antialiasing and other stuff. You can flip a flag on the latest builds to try the Direct Type engine, and it looks a lot better.

Re: The Chrome Distortion: how Chrome negatively alters our expectations

#84
post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Pretty much describes the archetypal difference between Apple and Google, end-user experience vs engineers developing for engineers ... and those pesky end-users if we must.

Wat. Safari ios is the most obtuse browser regarding to standards, makes devs life miserable in every conceivable way, breaks every standard web interaction since 199x (like a top fixed navbar), has it's own opinion on transform origin, handles differently than every other pseudo elements positioning parent and to top it all when it crashes because it gobs more memory than the os can handle spits a message vague enou…

Safari is also the only desktop browser that can handle my "power user" web browsing style. Chrome completely falls over after a few dozen tabs are opened. Firefox holds up better, but still starts starts stuttering when it gets to 80–100 tabs. Safari keeps going fine with several hundred tabs.

Edit: For the folks who are apparently offended by my browser use, I’ll elaborate:

Why would anyone want a large number of tabs, you ask? Well, when researching a topic, it’s often useful to open in tabs, breadth-first style, every potentially relevant link in a network of {academic papers, historical web pages, wikipedia articles, ..}.

For me, it’s much more efficient to partition my browsing tasks into {open a bunch of tabs without looking closely at the content | go through the list of tabs in order, lightly skimming the content and closing any that aren’t relevant | dive deep into each relevant tab, reading carefully, taking notes, etc.}. I find that, as alternative strategies, both (a) trying to entirely finish with one tab before opening another, storing its hyperlinks in a text file for later examination, or (b) only opening links in the same tab, using the browser history as a linear linked list of my current place in the browsing tree, are much less effective.

Theoretically, my strategy could be done with a set of bookmarks, a list of links in a text file somewhere, one of those "read later" apps, etc. In practice, I find that it works better for me to just keep the tabs open in my browser. YMMV.

Anyway, now imagine you have 4–5 different long-term ongoing research interests/projects (possibly related). Sometimes, when diving into one topic, you end up stumbling across a useful tangent into one of the other topics you care about. Occasionally, the thing you stumble on is important enough to temporarily set aside the first topic (tabling the in-progress search by leaving all of the, say, 50 currently open tabs in their own window) and open up a new window to dive in on the second topic. Alternately, imagine you receive an important email, and need to suspend the entire research session for later. Again, it’s easier to just keep the window open with all the tabs in it, rather than closing everything and reconstructing it later.

This might not be the browsing style for everyone. But it works for me, and Safari is the only browser I’ve tried which holds up.

Re: The Chrome Distortion: how Chrome negatively alters our expectations

#85
post #81
post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://arewefastyet.com/#machine=29 has most popular benchmarks across most JavaScript eninges on multiple platforms Edit: actually this view is probably better for people who don't care about JavaScript engine internals: https://arewefastyet.com/#machine=31

The focus on JS benchmarks is becoming ludicrous. By far the biggest performance issue is DOM/CSS layout. JS is so fast on all browsers that the performance differences don't matter at all anymore, except for initial load (and if you're loading that much code on initial page load, you should re-evaluate your architecture).

I agree 100%, but they were asking for a place with JavaScript benchmarks, so I gave my favorite.

Re: The Chrome Distortion: how Chrome negatively alters our expectations

#86
post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm a Windows user, and one thing I dislike about Chrome on Windows is the text rendering. Here is a screenshot of some text from the Google Play store rendered in IE, Firefox and Chrome. Click the image to see it in its full size: http://imgur.com/yYKSNBB Firefox looks the best to me; Chrome the worst. IE is not great either, but it is better at larger font sizes than Chrome (IMO). You might argue that the differenc…

I have a CRT monitor, and Windows 8 font rendering is overall TERRIBLE on it, as in, heavily aliased AND full of colour fringes. So I installed MacType, only to find that Chrome has two ways to render fonts, and both are extremely wonky, I spent like 30 minutes tweaking MacType to my tastes, and then 3 hours re-tweaking it to make Chrome behave properly, it was a serious pain.

You can probably go through the cleartype calibration wizard to improve the font rendering, I'm basing that on the assumption that the out of the box settings are probably tuned to look good on generic lcd screens

Re: The Chrome Distortion: how Chrome negatively alters our expectations

#87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wat. Safari ios is the most obtuse browser regarding to standards, makes devs life miserable in every conceivable way, breaks every standard web interaction since 199x (like a top fixed navbar), has it's own opinion on transform origin, handles differently than every other pseudo elements positioning parent and to top it all when it crashes because it gobs more memory than the os can handle spits a message vague enou…

Safari is also the only desktop browser that can handle my "power user" web browsing style. Chrome completely falls over after a few dozen tabs are opened. Firefox holds up better, but still starts starts stuttering when it gets to 80–100 tabs. Safari keeps going fine with several hundred tabs. Edit: For the folks who are apparently offended by my browser use, I’ll elaborate: Why would anyone want a large number of t…

Several hundred tabs? Dear god

Re: The Chrome Distortion: how Chrome negatively alters our expectations

#88
post #64

How much of the poor performance discussed in this article is due to Chrome itself, and how much is due to the fact that Android devices tend to have worse single-core performance than iOS devices? Is there a browser for Android based on a recent version of WebKit (not Blink)? If so, that would help answer the question.

It would be interesting to know how Mobile Firefox compares to Mobile Chrome on Android. Maybe someone here can give us some insight into that.

I ran the Ember Complex List test on Chrome and Firefox on my Nexus 6P. Chrome averaged 240ms while Firefox scored 260ms. Both of these results are slower than the iPhone 5S score of 175ms.

Re: The Chrome Distortion: how Chrome negatively alters our expectations

#89
I'm curious to see some actual benchmarks... In my experience, Chrome still has the fastest JavaScript. It still renders WebGL pages the best (although Emscripten allows Firefox some impressive feats).

Does Safari have some special extensions for the shitty 'native look' apps I encounter at Apple.com? Did their JavaScript engine become 100x faster in the year or so since I've used it? Is the author comparing an iPhone 6S plus to a Galaxy S3?

This article basically raises more questions than answers since there's literally no objective analysis of any sort...

There's not even an example of a page that runs on mobile Safari well but bad on Chrome, to allow me to see for myself. Just lots of handwaving.

Edit - No responses?

Anyhow, I eventually figured I'd try hammerjs' examples, since that's one of OP's projects. On a Galaxy Note 3, Chrome is pretty shit, Firefox works well. On an iPhone 5S, Safari is shit.

Re: The Chrome Distortion: how Chrome negatively alters our expectations

#90

I don't know about that Safari ranking. I get a super-fun rainbow wheel at least 2 or 3 times a day on Safari with only 3 or 4 tabs, and I rarely get that through chrome with upwards of 30. Before you give a score to every browser, why don't you back it up with something objective?

I noticed the adblock extension on safari makes it freeze up for a second when I open a new tab. apart from that, soooooo much snappier than chrome. (desktop, not mobile ofc)

I had that same problem with Adblock.

Much happier now on Safari and uBlock.

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