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The Search for the Perfect To-do List

steveworsley.com

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Re: The Search for the Perfect To-do List

#61

Post by slantyyz »

Chris2048 wrote: post #59
codingdave wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are going beyond To Do Lists and stepping into full project management systems. I suppose there would be nothing stopping you from using PM software as a to do list... you would just need to focus your searches on "Project Management", because that is the feature set you are describing.

But I find all tasks to be done, face these constraints, and need to be managed in this way. PM software tends to include other stuff - like team management, SLA considerations etc. dependencies should be part of any task management system IMHO.

I think you might be blurring the lines between task management and to do lists.

To do lists are what the name implies, a list of things to do.

Once you start adding things like dependencies, etc. to a to do list, it's not really a to do list any more.

If you are going to be that detailed about how you do your tasks, then a traditional Project Management tool (like Microsoft Project) is probably what you need.

Sure it's going to have some extra features you don't want, but nothing is forcing you to use those features, especially if the task management part satisfies your primary needs for dependency tracking, estimate/deadline rollups, etc.

Re: The Search for the Perfect To-do List

#62

Post by steve_w »

cableshaft wrote: post #60

So a while back I came up with my ideal way to keep track of progress and next steps for my personal projects, and this seems like a good place to get feedback on it. I often neglect to work on them at the end of the day, because I forget I'm working on so many and what I need to do in them, so I need a reminder of various things I've come up with, which ones I'm actively working on, which ones are on the backburner,…

I can't really help with the rest but if you wanted to track units of work without putting it against a task you could try FocusBooster (https://www.focusboosterapp.com/) which allows you log blocks of 25mins using the Pomodoro technique.

Re: The Search for the Perfect To-do List

#63

Post by Chris2048 »

julianpye wrote: post #40
Chris2048 wrote: post #28

I haven't found a decent ToDo list with this killer feature: dependencies. I want to mark a task as dependant on another being done. I want to add time estimates to those tasks, and see a gantt chart. I want tasks to show the sum of their dependencies estimates next to their own estimates. I want priorities to also flow through dependency chains in this manner - if a high priority task is dependant on a low priority…

This is key for any ADDers - chains of dependencies to ensure that not only raisins are picked off your ToDo List and you get to only see next steps and not all steps. For the past three years I have been working on this in an app sideproject and planned to launch the beta this winter, but I keep getting distracted :) Android alpha testers can get in touch with me.

Yeah, with some TODO managers I've used, the routine was to label things by how frequently I should check them. I ended up re-visiting a lot of things unnecessarily. I was always afraid of a task slipping through the net.

Good search functionality helps, but so does useful metadata attached to tasks to search on i.e. which tasks haven't I looked at in 3 months.

Re: The Search for the Perfect To-do List

#64

Post by Chris2048 »

Chris2048 wrote: post #28

I haven't found a decent ToDo list with this killer feature: dependencies. I want to mark a task as dependant on another being done. I want to add time estimates to those tasks, and see a gantt chart. I want tasks to show the sum of their dependencies estimates next to their own estimates. I want priorities to also flow through dependency chains in this manner - if a high priority task is dependant on a low priority…

Actually, Just found a thoughtstream item I dumped a bunch of Todo list manager features I'd like to see, obviously I've thought too much about this o_o;

https://thoughtstreams.io/Chris2048/design-ideas/5907/

Re: The Search for the Perfect To-do List

#65

Post by nextos »

bachmeier wrote: post #5
nextos wrote: post #4

IMHO GTD-based approaches are not optimal for knowledge workers cause they don't limit work-in-progress, and this ends up being overwhelming.

I'm not sure I understand your comment (I don't know what you mean by "limit work-in-progress") but one of the principles is to be explicit and formal about all the projects you've got going, as opposed to having fuzzy ideas about an unlimited number of potential projects in your head. When you track all of these projects, you adopt a more realistic approach, and you think more carefully about whether or not to start…

I mean GTD got lots of things right (have an inbox, split tasks/tasks with deadlines/events), but it is missing the WIP limit from kanban which is very important.

Re: The Search for the Perfect To-do List

#66

Post by miguelrochefort »

Chris2048 wrote: post #28

I haven't found a decent ToDo list with this killer feature: dependencies. I want to mark a task as dependant on another being done. I want to add time estimates to those tasks, and see a gantt chart. I want tasks to show the sum of their dependencies estimates next to their own estimates. I want priorities to also flow through dependency chains in this manner - if a high priority task is dependant on a low priority…

Precisely this.

Beyond that, we need opportunity tracking. Often, there is a very small window in progress can be made on a task. It could be an unique event, a recurring event, a time of day, access to a resource, etc.

- Buy milk when you're near milk - Talk to John when you're near John - Tan when they sun is bright - Catch the train in the next 5 minutes otherwise you'll wait an hour for the next

You can't make a cake if you never have all the ingredients together at once. Synchronization is extremely important. Your basic to-do list lacks the awareness of the world to make you and others more productive.

This is a general problem that deserves a general solution.

Re: The Search for the Perfect To-do List

#67

Post by Chris2048 »

miguelrochefort wrote: post #66
Chris2048 wrote: post #28

I haven't found a decent ToDo list with this killer feature: dependencies. I want to mark a task as dependant on another being done. I want to add time estimates to those tasks, and see a gantt chart. I want tasks to show the sum of their dependencies estimates next to their own estimates. I want priorities to also flow through dependency chains in this manner - if a high priority task is dependant on a low priority…

Precisely this. Beyond that, we need opportunity tracking. Often, there is a very small window in progress can be made on a task. It could be an unique event, a recurring event, a time of day, access to a resource, etc. - Buy milk when you're near milk - Talk to John when you're near John - Tan when they sun is bright - Catch the train in the next 5 minutes otherwise you'll wait an hour for the next You can't make a…

It's be interesting for a company like google to tackle this, e.g.

"Your Todo item suggests you are wanting to bake a cake soon? You hovered over a cake recipe using vanilla pods. The store nearby stocks Foo brand vanilla pods for $12..."

Maybe a little too complex though ;-D

Re: The Search for the Perfect To-do List

#68

Post by miguelrochefort »

The perfect to-do list will be a semantic marketplace of outcomes.

You describe the outcomes you want in life using a formal semantic language, and broadcast them for the world to see. Then, anyone who has the ability to satisfy the expected outcome (i.e., "I'm at work at 8AM") - bet it yourself, a friend, or a taxi driver - can engage in a contract where the conditions of all parties are described and agreed upon. Then, the contract or commitment to make an ideal become real becomes your task.

Software will simply become an interface to an ideal world, expressed through deltas with the real world. Your job as an agent is to maintain ideals you committed to maintain (i.e., "Don't drive when drunk", "Don't eat peanuts", "Keep your blood sugar below 150", "Don't have your location be within an area that's private property you don't have access to").

Laws of physics, laws of your state, preferences and other contracts populate the ideal you're expected to maintain and approach. Failing to do that hurts your social credit score, which in turns lowers the chance others will bring the world closer to your own ideals.

A to-do list is just a list of things that are wrong with the world. Until we have a system that enables us to precisely communicate and share these deltas, actions will remain meaningless words on a piece of physical/digital paper that only a motivated human can parse.

Re: The Search for the Perfect To-do List

#69

Post by miguelrochefort »

Chris2048 wrote: post #67
miguelrochefort wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Precisely this. Beyond that, we need opportunity tracking. Often, there is a very small window in progress can be made on a task. It could be an unique event, a recurring event, a time of day, access to a resource, etc. - Buy milk when you're near milk - Talk to John when you're near John - Tan when they sun is bright - Catch the train in the next 5 minutes otherwise you'll wait an hour for the next You can't make a…

It's be interesting for a company like google to tackle this, e.g. "Your Todo item suggests you are wanting to bake a cake soon? You hovered over a cake recipe using vanilla pods. The store nearby stocks Foo brand vanilla pods for $12..." Maybe a little too complex though ;-D

Most likely, you just want a cake and don't care to bake it.

A big obstacle to collaboration and global productivity is the assumption that it is cheaper/better to make something yourself rather than purchase it. It couldn't be further from the truth. An expert baker will bake cheaper and better cakes than I ever could.

> Maybe a little too complex though ;-D

It is more important than it is complex. Humanity has waited long enough, it's time we take that step.

Re: The Search for the Perfect To-do List

#70

Post by mathattack »

goshx wrote: post #12
mathattack wrote: post #9

I'm very interested in the topic as I've struggled to replace the efficacy of my old Franklin Planner. I've tried Google calendar reminders, and that hasn't worked. Evernote hasn't been great either. I don't want to go back to Notepad. Maybe the issue is having the discipline to spend 15 minutes a day planning?

was discipline an issue with your old Franklin Planner?

No. I'd spend 15 mins at the start of the day, and would take it everywhere except the bathroom.

My intuition is that there should be something similar on a smartphone.

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