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Boom (YC W16) – Supersonic Passenger Airplanes

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Re: Boom (YC W16) – Supersonic Passenger Airplanes

#201

Post by bscholl »

elinchrome wrote: post #195
bscholl wrote: post #192

Hi - I'm Blake, Founder/CEO at Boom. After watching no tangible progress in supersonics since Concorde was shut down, I started Boom because I want supersonic flight in our lifetime. Not just as a private jet, but something most anyone can afford to fly. Will try to answer as many questions here as I can.

How does the environmental impact per passenger compare to a modern passenger jet? Do you actually think most anyone can afford $5000 round trip to London?

We have the same gas mileage (fuel per seat mile) as a lay-flat bed in business class. Since the aircraft can do nearly 3X as many trips in the same time, on net it's better.

That's just the start of course—with more innovation on fuel efficiency the price and emissions both come down.

$5,000 is what a business class ticket NY/London costs today, and many business travelers are able to do that routinely. This compares to up to $20k on Concorde.

We will get the $5,000 way down over time—this is just the start.

Re: Boom (YC W16) – Supersonic Passenger Airplanes

#202

Post by mmcclure »

elinchrome wrote: post #195
bscholl wrote: post #192

Hi - I'm Blake, Founder/CEO at Boom. After watching no tangible progress in supersonics since Concorde was shut down, I started Boom because I want supersonic flight in our lifetime. Not just as a private jet, but something most anyone can afford to fly. Will try to answer as many questions here as I can.

How does the environmental impact per passenger compare to a modern passenger jet? Do you actually think most anyone can afford $5000 round trip to London?

> Do you actually think most anyone can afford $5000 round trip to London?

I'm genuinely curious where you got "most anyone" from their marketing copy. I read it as "affordable for people flying business class," but that might be because I was thinking in the context of Concorde pricing.

Edit: Derp, totally glossed over that part of the parent comment.

Re: Boom (YC W16) – Supersonic Passenger Airplanes

#203

Post by Pyxl101 »

bscholl wrote: post #192

Hi - I'm Blake, Founder/CEO at Boom. After watching no tangible progress in supersonics since Concorde was shut down, I started Boom because I want supersonic flight in our lifetime. Not just as a private jet, but something most anyone can afford to fly. Will try to answer as many questions here as I can.

Exciting work! I'd be glad if supersonic flight was a reality again.

How do you plan to tackle the challenge of opposition to supersonic flight? Overland supersonic flight has been banned in US and Europe because the loud noise of sonic booms annoyed residents that the planes flew over. Coastal residents continued to object to supersonic flight. Is there a path to offering transcontinental flights again, and if not, will the program be viable with only trans-oceanic flights? (I notice NYC/London highlighted in the marketing materials)

Alternatively, is there a viable way to make supersonic flight quiet enough to fly overland? (That would be a game changer!)

Re: Boom (YC W16) – Supersonic Passenger Airplanes

#204

Post by bscholl »

ADRIANFR wrote: post #198
bscholl wrote: post #192

Hi - I'm Blake, Founder/CEO at Boom. After watching no tangible progress in supersonics since Concorde was shut down, I started Boom because I want supersonic flight in our lifetime. Not just as a private jet, but something most anyone can afford to fly. Will try to answer as many questions here as I can.

Is SFO-NYC a feasible route for Boom?

Unfortunately, there's a ban on supersonic travel over land in the US since the 1970s. When this is reversed, we can fly SFO-JFK in about 2:20.

Re: Boom (YC W16) – Supersonic Passenger Airplanes

#206

Post by JoshTriplett »

bscholl wrote: post #192

Hi - I'm Blake, Founder/CEO at Boom. After watching no tangible progress in supersonics since Concorde was shut down, I started Boom because I want supersonic flight in our lifetime. Not just as a private jet, but something most anyone can afford to fly. Will try to answer as many questions here as I can.

Obviously, shortening an international flight provides the highest value for your first major route. How well can this scale down to domestic flights? Turning a 3-4 hour flight into a 60-90 minute flight, or a 90 minute flight into a 30 minute flight, appeals quite a bit.

EDIT: your answer at https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11330935 applies here.

Do you have concrete plans to change those regulations? Do you have solutions for the problems addressed by those regulations (e.g. noise)? Will this scale down well if you have to reach a certain altitude first?

Re: Boom (YC W16) – Supersonic Passenger Airplanes

#207

Post by david-given »

BinaryIdiot wrote: post #167
jessaustin wrote: post #154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure, but these were 1980s-era fighter/trainer jets flying at probably 1000 ft., and it only shook the whole house when they flew pretty close. Other times one might only hear the boom when outside. I think a passenger craft of recent design of recent materials, flying at 40k ft. could do much better, even before routing to avoid populated areas. I don't think anyone, even those who live on ranches in the Dakotas, re…

I could have sworn the Concorde was still glass-breaking loud at 40,000. Reardless, NASA is working on getting rid of the sonic boom http://www.sciencealert.com/nasa-is-building-a-jet-that-brea...

I used to live under the Concorde flight path near Heathrow. Twice a day there'd be this crackling rumble and all the windows would shake; and this was flying subsonic.

Concorde was really, really loud --- a lot of that was due to being a really old plane with old engines (aircraft have gotten way quieter since the 1970s), but even back then it was considered loud:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/3581192.stm

It was exempt from the usual noise regulations and on takeoff it'd set of car alarms in the airport carparks.

I still miss it, despite the noise. I'd hear the noise and look up, and there'd be this beautiful delta-wing shape slipping through the clouds...

Re: Boom (YC W16) – Supersonic Passenger Airplanes

#208

Post by bscholl »

Pyxl101 wrote: post #203
bscholl wrote: post #192

Hi - I'm Blake, Founder/CEO at Boom. After watching no tangible progress in supersonics since Concorde was shut down, I started Boom because I want supersonic flight in our lifetime. Not just as a private jet, but something most anyone can afford to fly. Will try to answer as many questions here as I can.

Exciting work! I'd be glad if supersonic flight was a reality again. How do you plan to tackle the challenge of opposition to supersonic flight? Overland supersonic flight has been banned in US and Europe because the loud noise of sonic booms annoyed residents that the planes flew over. Coastal residents continued to object to supersonic flight. Is there a path to offering transcontinental flights again, and if not,…

Thanks! We are very excited to be doing this.

We're starting out focused on long flights that are mostly over water, like New York - London or San Francisco - Shanghai.

Around an airport, our airplane will be about as quiet as other new aircraft. The sonic boom will also be much quieter—and we'll continue to make future iterations even quieter. It's hard to say exactly when, but I expect the supersonic overland ban will be reversed in the coming years.

Re: Boom (YC W16) – Supersonic Passenger Airplanes

#209

Post by mathieuh »

mmcclure wrote: post #202
elinchrome wrote: post #195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How does the environmental impact per passenger compare to a modern passenger jet? Do you actually think most anyone can afford $5000 round trip to London?

> Do you actually think most anyone can afford $5000 round trip to London? I'm genuinely curious where you got "most anyone" from their marketing copy. I read it as "affordable for people flying business class," but that might be because I was thinking in the context of Concorde pricing. Edit: Derp, totally glossed over that part of the parent comment.

> Not just as a private jet, but something most anyone can afford to fly

From the original comment.

Re: Boom (YC W16) – Supersonic Passenger Airplanes

#210

Post by trhway »

nickff wrote: post #169
neurotech1 wrote: post #143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I doubt the cost would be low enough to support demand. Transonic (approximately Mach 0.80 - 1.2) flight uses significantly more fuel than subsonic flight does. Business jets like the Gulfstream G550 burn more fuel at M0.9 than regional Boeing 717(MD-95) at M0.75 with 4 times more passengers. The F-22 Raptor can supercruise at M1.6, with half the range compared to cruise at M0.85 similar to other fighters. If Boom ca…

The Boeing 747 has one of the lowest cost/passenger mile (CPM) of any aircraft, and cruises at Mach 0.85. Different aircraft have been optimized for different speeds, and while it is true that a supersonic aircraft will likely have a higher fuel cost than a comparable subsonic aircraft, the difference may not be as large as we currently think. There has never been a supersonic passenger aircraft built with modern tur…

>There has never been a supersonic passenger aircraft built with modern turbofan engines.

that is one of the major issues here. Modern turbofans on large passenger planes like 787, 380, etc... are that efficient in major part because of high by-pass ratio. Which is not really an option for 2Mach+ speed.

As somebody mentioned, more comfortable 0.85Mach flight would be preferable in many situations to uncomfortable and very expensive 2Mach. If i were starting something like this i'd go straight for suborbital SFO to Singapore in under couple hours. Technology-level wise not that different, money is no issue in that segment (Branson's $200K is not that far from super-premium-business class for your priceless CEO) and there is always large money-no-issue fallback customer - military.

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