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Windows 7 computers are automatically starting the Windows 10 upgrade

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Re: Windows 7 computers are automatically starting the Windows 10 upgrade

#121

Post by chris_wot »

ourmandave wrote: post #67
ubernostrum wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I know clickwrap EULAs have been contentious, but can a EULA for something you didn't even ask for and didn't want in the first place be forced on you against your will?

I had the option to not accept the EULA. In that case I was then free to not install Windows 10 despite it "prepping my system for the update" for an hour. I figured any attempt at a roll back at that point would have been worse than just proceeding. =(

That's interesting. If the OS upgrades to Windows 10, does it prompt you to accept a new EULA after upgrading? If so, what does it do if you don't accept the new terms? And how can they ask you to accept terms AFTER upgrading?

Re: Windows 7 computers are automatically starting the Windows 10 upgrade

#122

Post by makecheck »

chris_wot wrote: post #100
HelloMcFly wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Perhaps people from MS trying to do damage control? While I appreciate the rest of your comment, I personally find comment like these are obnoxious. I sincerely doubt that vote and comment brigading are anywhere near as prevalent as reddit and this community seem to so routinely imply. Perhaps I'm the naive one, but it is tiresome to so regularly see comments (especially those close to one's own personal beliefs) c…

I would normally agree, but Microsoft have a very well known pattern of astroturfing. Hell, they invented practically invented the Internet version in 2001. I'd like to think that under Satya Nadella's reign they would have stopped, but they are still doing dodgy shit like forced upgrades to Windows 10. To say that this is an utter PR nightmare is a complete understatement. If, as some comments indicate, they have br…

A lawsuit would be very reasonable. The hard part would be deciding on suitable damages, because the reality is that we’re not just talking about the cost of restoring a computer; these days, a trashed machine is more like somebody breaking into your room and destroying all of your personal stuff.

The really sad thing is that it should have taken about 2 or 3 people at Microsoft, tops, to anticipate the first 10 things that could not only go wrong with their upgrade plan, but very, very wrong. Were those reasonable people shouted out of the room?

Re: Windows 7 computers are automatically starting the Windows 10 upgrade

#123

Post by shostack »

TazeTSchnitzel wrote: post #73
largote wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The high-end market is mostly gamers, which is 95%+ Windows.

Microsoft's Windows Store/UWP push has scared some game developers, most notably causing Valve to make a Linux version of Steam and their own OS. A concerted effort by the games industry could see Windows's market share fall there.

Just got my new laptop with Win10 because I'm a gamer. That was pretty much the only reason.

If they ever pull shit with Steam, are proven to have mishandled my data as part of the telemetry bullshit (well, the stuff I couldn't disable, because I spent half an hour trying to turn off all the various settings I could), or ever force Windows into a subscription model, I'm done with gaming on Windows for good and I'll suffer through the Linux gaming experience.

Hopefully by that point there will be enough weight behind it to make switching an easy choice.

Re: Windows 7 computers are automatically starting the Windows 10 upgrade

#124

Post by Delmania »

throwaway_1012 wrote: post #85

Agreed. Where do the shills like shanselman go when you actually have a genuine criticism?

What would he do? What can he do? He works in DivDev on ASP.NET; he's not the person who made the call to make Win10 a required upgrade. He can't speak for the company. Seriously, the company employs over 100,000 people and is in over 100 countries. The people who visit and comment on HN are a tiny percentage, probably more in software and hardware side. Amazingly, companies do things their employees don't like on a daily basis.

Re: Windows 7 computers are automatically starting the Windows 10 upgrade

#125

Post by chris_wot »

krapp wrote: post #8
mchahn wrote: post #6

Wouldn't the automatic upgrade mean you didn't agree to any T&C?

You did agree if you set Windows Update to automatically install updates. The upgrade to Window 10 is being treated as an "update".

In 2010 Microsoft's update of Security Essentials changed Windows update from manual to automatic. [1] With an installation base in the hundreds of millions, if even 1% of users didn't know about this and switched to manual update, then that's a hell of a lot of people who are affected.

1. http://www.infoworld.com/article/2627526/antimalware/warning...

Re: Windows 7 computers are automatically starting the Windows 10 upgrade

#126

Post by yarou »

chris_wot wrote: post #108
throwaway_1012 wrote: post #85

Agreed. Where do the shills like shanselman go when you actually have a genuine criticism?

Dude. Personal attacks aren't welcome here. I think you know this, as you are using a throwaway account.

And yet the law is applied unfairly on HN. Dang warned me that I'd be banned if I ever insinuated that somebody was shilling, yet several people are openly doing it in this thread. I don't see their warnings.

Sorry for continuing the derail, but it's downright infuriating when you see moderation not applied equally to everyone.

Re: Windows 7 computers are automatically starting the Windows 10 upgrade

#128

Post by capabit »

robertelder wrote: post #59

Re-posting my comment from the other thread which didn't get as much attention: I spent about 3 hours this week doing tech support for my mom over the phone because of Windows 10's aggressive upgrading behaviour. I told her to keep her the best way to keep safe security wise is to make sure the os/browser is up to date, and because Windows 10 keeps asking to upgrade, she went ahead and did so. After upgrading to Wind…

> Also, there seems to be a number of people here commenting very strongly in favour of Microsoft

Count me (shockingly) in the pro Microsoft group here. After years and years of supporting family PCs, I understand and appreciate what they're trying to do.

If you make updating something the user has to do, they'll never do it.

If you prompt them to update, they'll never do it. Even if they've had the why of it explained to them many, many times.

In anticipation of the inevitable "well this update famously broke X": yes, the risk of an update doing something funky outweighs the risk of running software with known and possibly currently exploited vulnerabilities.

Re: Windows 7 computers are automatically starting the Windows 10 upgrade

#129

Post by chrsstrm »

marklawrutgers wrote: post #89
robertelder wrote: post #59

Re-posting my comment from the other thread which didn't get as much attention: I spent about 3 hours this week doing tech support for my mom over the phone because of Windows 10's aggressive upgrading behaviour. I told her to keep her the best way to keep safe security wise is to make sure the os/browser is up to date, and because Windows 10 keeps asking to upgrade, she went ahead and did so. After upgrading to Wind…

I had this exact same issue with my work machine and my at home workstation. Wifi adapter completely broken, I tried to revert back to Windows 8 on my work machine and it gets stuck on a black screen for over 24 hours. I tried to power down to restart it but no luck. Somehow everything got corrupted. Had to completely reformat the drive and install the operating system all over again, which it then proceeded to upgra…

Same scenario three weeks ago trying to help out my brother on his brand new Asus that came with Win 10. The wireless hardware just disappeared from the control panel so the option to update the driver wasn't available. I was about to walk him through a complete OS re-install with the option to keep his files until he decided that a wired connection was OK. At the time there was almost no available recent support articles on this issue, but I'm starting to think a Win update caused this after seeing others with the same problem. And here he was going to blame it on his kids...

Re: Windows 7 computers are automatically starting the Windows 10 upgrade

#130

Post by krapp »

yarou wrote: post #126
chris_wot wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Dude. Personal attacks aren't welcome here. I think you know this, as you are using a throwaway account.

And yet the law is applied unfairly on HN. Dang warned me that I'd be banned if I ever insinuated that somebody was shilling, yet several people are openly doing it in this thread. I don't see their warnings. Sorry for continuing the derail, but it's downright infuriating when you see moderation not applied equally to everyone.

It's more likely that there isn't a moderator available to watch every thread 24/7.
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