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Youngest Kids in Class at Higher Risk of ADHD Diagnosis

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Re: Youngest Kids in Class at Higher Risk of ADHD Diagnosis

#81
post #72
post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is off of the top of my head, but something like 50% of people treated for depression show positive response for the treatment, and 20% achieve "full recovery" (still on meds but the symptoms linked to depression are basically gone while on meds). Meaning these people can move on with their lives not having to deal with this. Medicated treatment for ADHD has hit even higher numbers. Something like 70% of patient…

I consider it one of the great paradoxes of modern thought that the loudest proponents of evolutionary theory are often the loudest proponents/defenders of pharmaceutical-based treatment for mental illness. So the logic is: - evolution is this amazingly powerful process that has resulted in the development of a vast diversity of astonishingly sophisticated and beautiful species of plants and animals, with the most ad…

Do you also advocate stopping cancer treatments? Stopping vaccinations, because not getting smallpox is interfering with evolution?

Evolution doesn't happen for a reason. The whole point of evolution is that our biology and the way our brains work is bafflingly random at times. Depression is a crippling mental illness, it doesn't happen for a reason.

Re: Youngest Kids in Class at Higher Risk of ADHD Diagnosis

#82
post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is very belittling to the amazing amount of research that goes into ADHD. Many studies have been done with regard to treatment and diagnosis, and at this point we are better able to treat ADHD than we are able to treat depression There might be a bit of an over-treatment culture (I'm not sure, though), but the science is extremely well developed and tested

There's a big difference between the rigor of the question of whether ADHD is a real thing or that of ADHD diagnoses being reliable in practice. There are huge regional variations to rates of ADHD diagnosis. For example, it's 3.5x higher in North Carolina vs. Nevada. There doesn't seem to be any reason why this would be given that ADHD is believed to be almost entirely genetic. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1964…

Genetic predisposition doesn't mean a guarantee. There are often environmental factors.

Also, you're assuming two things: 1) that genes are evenly distributed among the population, which they're not. And, 2) that diagnosis and treatment options are the same everywhere, which they're not.

Re: Youngest Kids in Class at Higher Risk of ADHD Diagnosis

#83
post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is very belittling to the amazing amount of research that goes into ADHD. Many studies have been done with regard to treatment and diagnosis, and at this point we are better able to treat ADHD than we are able to treat depression There might be a bit of an over-treatment culture (I'm not sure, though), but the science is extremely well developed and tested

There's a big difference between the rigor of the question of whether ADHD is a real thing or that of ADHD diagnoses being reliable in practice. There are huge regional variations to rates of ADHD diagnosis. For example, it's 3.5x higher in North Carolina vs. Nevada. There doesn't seem to be any reason why this would be given that ADHD is believed to be almost entirely genetic. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1964…

I'd argue that adhd isn't the disease, rather our culture that cannot deal with inquisitive minds.

Re: Youngest Kids in Class at Higher Risk of ADHD Diagnosis

#85
The thing is, the youngest child is not just taken to the specialists with the suspect of ADHD, it really is diagnosed with ADHD. Gifted children also diagnosed frequently with ADHD, they even have a name for it, twice exceptional. The ADHD comes to me like a deviation from the social standarts. What's normal, and what's not. For most children, ADHD is not a cause of worry until school age. The normal student is defined by current education system. ADHD comes to me like being gay, you are not sick or nothing's wrong with you, just different than the average, and have problems with fitting in the current social standarts.

Re: Youngest Kids in Class at Higher Risk of ADHD Diagnosis

#86
post #72
post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is off of the top of my head, but something like 50% of people treated for depression show positive response for the treatment, and 20% achieve "full recovery" (still on meds but the symptoms linked to depression are basically gone while on meds). Meaning these people can move on with their lives not having to deal with this. Medicated treatment for ADHD has hit even higher numbers. Something like 70% of patient…

I consider it one of the great paradoxes of modern thought that the loudest proponents of evolutionary theory are often the loudest proponents/defenders of pharmaceutical-based treatment for mental illness. So the logic is: - evolution is this amazingly powerful process that has resulted in the development of a vast diversity of astonishingly sophisticated and beautiful species of plants and animals, with the most ad…

As someone who has dealt with ADHD both with and without medication, at least from my experience this line of reasoning leads to much pain.

I cannot speak for those with depression, but ADHD has easily tripled the amount of stress I have in my life, if not more. It causes impulsive behaviour that can wreck relationships(both personal and professional), and makes it extremely hard to concentrate on many things that aren't totally gamified from the outset.

There's a trope about how ADHD ends up being a gift because of creative thoughts coming to you, and that the medication will dull your senses... but I don't buy it too much. There have been studies that have measured no noticable difference in "creative capabilities"(hard to measure, granted) when being medicated and non-medicated.

Before being put on medication, I had never finished a single piece of homework in my life. Afterwards I was able to finish the homework assignments before class was even over. I would study autonomously, and was able to reach my full potential because I was able to manage my thoughts for the first time in my life.

There is no moral high-ground to not medicating oneself, just like there is no moral high-ground to using crutches when you have a broken leg. Asking me not to medicate is the same as asking me to go through meaningless suffering in almost every social interaction. Countless studies have shown that medication is much much more effective than any form of behavioural therapy (and that BT has an extremely high failure/"relapse" rate).

I don't think it's right to mock people looking for non-medical treatment, because various reasons mean you cannot have access to alternatives.

But medication has been proven to be very effective, and BT has proven to be a very difficult path... if you are a parent of a child suffering from ADHD it is your duty to at least explore the medication option in my opinion.

There is likely to be no higher reason for ADHD and depression to exist. We have looked at "normal people's" brains, and see that for depression/ADHD some things work differently. And that these people tend to have lower-quality lives because of a lack of something... It's hard to argue that there's a reason for it all except in some religious context. It's not like there's a higher reason for brain tumors either.

As an aside, despite the fact that I currently love where I live (Japan), I always consider moving back to the US if only to get access to medication that is illegal here. My life is a lot shittier (still great overall though) because of some drug laws. I have spent a lot of time working on different non-medical coping techniques that have helped out a lot, but nothing matched the chemicals.

Re: Youngest Kids in Class at Higher Risk of ADHD Diagnosis

#87
post #86
post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I consider it one of the great paradoxes of modern thought that the loudest proponents of evolutionary theory are often the loudest proponents/defenders of pharmaceutical-based treatment for mental illness. So the logic is: - evolution is this amazingly powerful process that has resulted in the development of a vast diversity of astonishingly sophisticated and beautiful species of plants and animals, with the most ad…

As someone who has dealt with ADHD both with and without medication, at least from my experience this line of reasoning leads to much pain. I cannot speak for those with depression, but ADHD has easily tripled the amount of stress I have in my life, if not more. It causes impulsive behaviour that can wreck relationships(both personal and professional), and makes it extremely hard to concentrate on many things that ar…

Is your medication amphetamine-based?

Re: Youngest Kids in Class at Higher Risk of ADHD Diagnosis

#88
post #72
post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is off of the top of my head, but something like 50% of people treated for depression show positive response for the treatment, and 20% achieve "full recovery" (still on meds but the symptoms linked to depression are basically gone while on meds). Meaning these people can move on with their lives not having to deal with this. Medicated treatment for ADHD has hit even higher numbers. Something like 70% of patient…

I consider it one of the great paradoxes of modern thought that the loudest proponents of evolutionary theory are often the loudest proponents/defenders of pharmaceutical-based treatment for mental illness. So the logic is: - evolution is this amazingly powerful process that has resulted in the development of a vast diversity of astonishingly sophisticated and beautiful species of plants and animals, with the most ad…

ADHD is a trait that drives a need to explore, to discover - it's a handy gene if you're a tribal nomad, and going finding that cool new valley will allow your genes to survive.

If you're a first world schlub, however, it prevents you from sitting tidily in your little box and people get mad and you get sad, because conformity is identity. Your genes only get passed on to a sports sock. There are no new valleys to discover.

So it works with both ideas - and depression isnt dissimilar - old adaptation for dealing with sickness, injury and winter that just isn't helpful anymore.

Cage a bird and you need to adapt its diet and care. Same with humans.

Re: Youngest Kids in Class at Higher Risk of ADHD Diagnosis

#89
post #87
post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As someone who has dealt with ADHD both with and without medication, at least from my experience this line of reasoning leads to much pain. I cannot speak for those with depression, but ADHD has easily tripled the amount of stress I have in my life, if not more. It causes impulsive behaviour that can wreck relationships(both personal and professional), and makes it extremely hard to concentrate on many things that ar…

Is your medication amphetamine-based?

Yeah, which is why it's banned here.

I've tried looking into alternatives but because ADHD isn't recognized in adults here it can be difficult to convince a physician

Re: Youngest Kids in Class at Higher Risk of ADHD Diagnosis

#90
post #78
post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's genuinely scary that you have any contact with children Please stop posting personal attacks to Hacker News, regardless of how strongly you feel about a subject.

Sorry adrusi and dang. I'll stop posting to threads like these.

Please keep posting.

I really like your comments and believe we need more of what you have to say on HN.

Just try to develop the ability to avoid getting emotionally charged and venting your emotional energy on other commenters.

It's something I've been working on for a long time and I can assure you it's worth the effort.

You're most welcome to email me if you want some suggestions on effective techniques.

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