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Why killer whales should not be kept in captivity

bbc.com

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Re: Why killer whales should not be kept in captivity

#31

Post by thesagan »

DamnYuppie wrote: post #25
funkyy wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Attacks on humans by Orcas happens. Its that they do not eat humans, once they realize its us, they let go and swim away. They need to taste us first, especially if none of the members of group haven't tasted or interacted with humans before.

Same with most sharks. They have to bite you to know what you are, most shark attacks are quick strikes and then they let the victim go.

Really? Wow, a lot to learn in this thread!

Seems like we might not be very palatable for many creatures (or are just too bizarre for them to eat).

Re: Why killer whales should not be kept in captivity

#32

Post by kefka »

Joof wrote: post #18
staticautomatic wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it was the political philosopher Robert Nozick who posed a related question: If it's acceptable for humans to eat "lower" life forms, then would it be acceptable for a much more intelligent or sentient alien race to eat humans?

That's a question where its extroidinarily hard to draw the line. Assuming it is immoral to consume another life form, then there goes 100% of our food source (plants are life and show some intelligence in aggregate). If nothing can consume anything else then life can't exist. I'd argue that their ethical standards are wholly separate from our own. For humans, self-preservation as a race is very important.

Not only that, but plants respond to stimuli, remember, chemically 'moan' when sick, scream when they are being harmed or killed (grass cutting), and talk amongst each other (again, chemical triggers).

If you don't eat living things, that leaves milk and honey.

I'm not saying "become X-ist". I'm saying that in order for us to live, others must die. Plants, animals and others aren't inherently worth more or less than we humans. But it's our responsibility to remember their sacrifices so we could continue.

Re: Why killer whales should not be kept in captivity

#34

Post by darklajid »

wfunction wrote: post #29
darklajid wrote: post #27

My wife keeps hitting me when I (intentionally, to mess with her) call these creatures 'killer whales'. The name doesn't help, really. The subtitle is 'Keeping orcas in aquariums deprives them of crucial aspects of their lives, and in some cases it can even prove dangerous to humans'. BBC seems to know what these creatures are called, but prefers to use 'killer whales' in the title. Why? That's messed up, both in gen…

> Why? I'm guessing if someone doesn't know what an "orca" is then they won't get the title at all. Whereas everyone knows what a whale is, even if they don't know what a killer whale specifically is.

That's actually not a bad (albeit sad) point, but they constantly refer to 'also known as killer whale' in the article afterwards.

I mean, baiting to click the article ('killer whale') and showing the creature ('Hey, I know that one. Free Willy was a great movie!') should be enough, even if we accept your premise.

I'm mostly repeating what my better half wants me to say right now, but .. why would we call something a 'killer' (often hard to get right for people - killing in the animal kingdom isn't what we associate with a killer)? And why would we repeatedly do so in a plea to stop treating them badly?

Re: Why killer whales should not be kept in captivity

#35

Post by funkyy »

crispyambulance wrote: post #28
funkyy wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Attacks on humans by Orcas happens. Its that they do not eat humans, once they realize its us, they let go and swim away. They need to taste us first, especially if none of the members of group haven't tasted or interacted with humans before.

Good to know! Now which appendage should I offer for the tasting menu....

The smallest finger - hopefully its the one in your foot ;) But to be serious, I wonder if cutting yourself would be enough for them to taste you and go away or if it would have opposite effect.

Re: Why killer whales should not be kept in captivity

#36

Post by tn13 »

Being one-issue fundamentalist is always a bad thing. A sweeping statement "killer whales should not be ..." does not seem convincing.

No one is even trying to put all killer whales in aquarium. Having few of them where humans could watch them is a good thing. Where else would my 5 year old know about these giant creatures, after all he needs to do something for their preservation.

Watching wildlife up and close is a great experience just so we could empathize with their needs. I cared a damn about Polar Bears or Orangutans until I saw them up and close at San Diego zoo. Now I am much more willing to donate money that helps their cause.

Besides if an animal is entertaining for humans I think that is a great evolutionary trait that can help those animals survive. I don't see how else that df*k Panda would have survived on earth.

Re: Why killer whales should not be kept in captivity

#38

Post by DanBC »

cphoover wrote: post #24

I agree that killer whale's shouldn't be kept in captivity, but than on the other hand, I also love me some bacon. Pigs are also sentient creatures with high intelligence yet we see them as a food source, and thus don't really care about their conditions in captivity.

> and thus don't really care about their conditions in captivity.

Several vigorous campaigns existed to improve the conditions for pigs. Look at England for an example, where changes in English law were voluntarily followed by Danish and Dutch pig farmers so they could compete on welfare standards.

See also "free range" eggs and higher welfare farm standards.

Plenty of people like eating meat but will only buy meat from animals that have higher welfare standards.

Re: Why killer whales should not be kept in captivity

#39

Post by funkyy »

cphoover wrote: post #24

I agree that killer whale's shouldn't be kept in captivity, but than on the other hand, I also love me some bacon. Pigs are also sentient creatures with high intelligence yet we see them as a food source, and thus don't really care about their conditions in captivity.

Pigs are meant to be kept as farm animals. They were selectively domesticated. Same with chickens, sheep, cows etc. Problem with Orcas is that they are not use to live in captivity. They were just caught in the sea and forced to do tricks. Its same with large wild cats - they have been not selectively chosen over decades to join the human society.

Re: Why killer whales should not be kept in captivity

#40

Post by dpflan »

tn13 wrote: post #37
dpflan wrote: post #5

Blackfish is definitely a provocative documentary on this topic of killer whale captivity.

Sadly that documentary is one sided and what appears to be motivated documentary. We need to hear the other side too.

True, much needed for a full understanding. Though revelations like this raise suspicion about nefarious activity and whether the debate will be even: http://www.marketwatch.com/story/seaworld-admits-it-sent-spi...
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