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I stayed in a hotel with Android lightswitches and it was as bad as you'd think

mjg59.dreamwidth.org

71–80 of 325 posts

Re: I stayed in a hotel with Android lightswitches and it was as bad as you'd think

#71

Why on earth are they using Modbus? Is there already some sort of industry standard (on Modbus) for remotely controlling hotel peripherals?

Modbus has been installed in hotels for years and years. They are probably using it because many hotels already have infrastructure in place for it.

Re: I stayed in a hotel with Android lightswitches and it was as bad as you'd think

#72
post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Keep in-mind that we're talking about always connected devices. Firmware updates could be done remotely without the end user needed to do anything, except perhaps give his approval.

Which introduces a whole new set of security challenges to prevent attackers from getting write access to the devices.

After you've fixed all bugs and plugged all security holes, you push a final update that disables all updates. Easy.

Re: I stayed in a hotel with Android lightswitches and it was as bad as you'd think

#73

I feel like I'm missing out on a huge bulk of money simply because when I have ideas of "Internet of Things", I cant get over the security obstacles and cancel the ideas. If only I just didn't care (or didnt know) and just implemented whatever the heck brought in money from oblivious customers.

I thought you were supposed to implement it in a basic way then have the investor money pay for other people to think through your project

Re: I stayed in a hotel with Android lightswitches and it was as bad as you'd think

#74
This is why I don't understand the "Internet of Things." A light switch is a pretty effective solution to the problem; there seems little advantage to networking it. Ditto for a toaster, refrigerator, et cetera, et cetera.

Now get off my lawn!

Re: I stayed in a hotel with Android lightswitches and it was as bad as you'd think

#75
post #22
post #4

This is the unfortunate outcome of a bunch of factors. OEMs moving to XXX over TCP protocols which have zero security by default and documenting this in the datasheets. VAR installers switching to the newer products because CAT5 cable is cheaper and easier to pull than what they used to use. The previous solution was just as insecure but harder to hack because you needed more specialised equipment. I'm not sure how w…

Also, for the particular case of MODBUS over TCP, MODBUS itself doesn't have any security aspect (by design) it is a very simple byte read/write protocol really. http://www.modbus.org/docs/Modbus_Application_Protocol_V1_1b...

Just read over their FAQ. They claim that Modbus over TCP is an internet protocol. No where do they even mention security. I wonder how many devices are sitting on IPv4 addresses that are completely controllable over the net without a shred of security. Lovely.

Re: I stayed in a hotel with Android lightswitches and it was as bad as you'd think

#77

I'm amused by the use of Modbus. I worked on Modbus networking back in the 1980's at Modicon (a company that disappeared long ago that created the "standard"). Using a protocol invented before the internet to control devices on a semi-public network is insane. The original Modbus was designed to communicate with factory devices controlled by logic controllers over serial and eventually over a custom token ring networ…

Perhaps the hotel's HVAC is running Modbus?

Could be. I just spent some time on the modbus.org site. I haven't looked in a while. There is pretty much no mention of security though they claim that Modbus over TCP is an internet protocol.

Re: I stayed in a hotel with Android lightswitches and it was as bad as you'd think

#79
post #11

I feel like I'm missing out on a huge bulk of money simply because when I have ideas of "Internet of Things", I cant get over the security obstacles and cancel the ideas. If only I just didn't care (or didnt know) and just implemented whatever the heck brought in money from oblivious customers.

Or you could just implement them as-is, earn a shitload of money and then enhance their security in the next version or with a firmware update once you'll have the luxury of investing in R&D. At least it's better if a security-wary entrepreneur implements them instead of someone who simply doesn't give a flying fuck.

I dislike that we live in a world where this is acceptable to people.

Re: I stayed in a hotel with Android lightswitches and it was as bad as you'd think

#80

I feel like I'm missing out on a huge bulk of money simply because when I have ideas of "Internet of Things", I cant get over the security obstacles and cancel the ideas. If only I just didn't care (or didnt know) and just implemented whatever the heck brought in money from oblivious customers.

Yes, I'm sure that the only thing standing between you and untold riches is your resistance to lax security measures in app-controlled sous vide machines.
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