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Trackers

jacquesmattheij.com

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Re: Trackers

#101

Post by roymurdock »

sdoering wrote: post #91
davb wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find it interesting that a lot of content producers have feel entitled to users' participation in analytics at all. Sure, it may be frustrating when a user blocks tracking tools (especially self hosted ones) but that's the their choice. We got by for decades without analysing user habits (even in a local only context, without correlation with third party data). There are so few examples of cases where analysing use…

In the "good ol' days" (TM the shop-owners in a community knew quite a lot about their customers. Oh Mary just gave birth, Henry is currently sick, Walter likes his coffee a little stronger, James a little weaker (something with his stomach). Danielle drinks only tee, has two kids and the marriage is not really happy. And so on. A lot bordered on gossip, a lot was very valid and relevant information. People talked. S…

I can't think of one website/company that I would like to have this small town clerk-customer relationship with.

Youtube's recommended videos are unfailingly terrible, and Amazon's recommended products just feel like annoying add-ons that might "accidentally" get bundled into my cart if I hover my mouse too near them. I generally already have something in mind if I want to buy/watch online.

I'll stick with recommendations from friends/actual people. That's why last.fm/spotify has been so great for music discovery relative to pandora/rdio - you can browse real people's collections instead of an algorithm's guess of what you might like.

Re: Trackers

#102

Post by ssharp »

davb wrote: post #41
Doctor_Fegg wrote: post #15

Believe it or not, some stores sympathise with you. They might actually be run by people like you, people who read your story. They still want to know how you proceed round the store, because that helps them optimise shelf layout, identify hard-to-find items, and so on. So yes, they might use the standard in-store CCTV to observe your journeys, and when they figure that you and people like you always have difficulty…

I find it interesting that a lot of content producers have feel entitled to users' participation in analytics at all. Sure, it may be frustrating when a user blocks tracking tools (especially self hosted ones) but that's the their choice. We got by for decades without analysing user habits (even in a local only context, without correlation with third party data). There are so few examples of cases where analysing use…

To be fair, you're not entitled to free content free of tracking either.

Re: Trackers

#103

Post by dhimes »

leereeves wrote: post #84
dhimes wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We got by for decades without analysing user habits Depends when you start counting the decades. Since Netscape and the 'coming out' of the www, we've always paid attention to where people go on our own web pages.

And stores have always paid attention to how many items they sell. But (continuing the metaphor) now they're tracking what each customer buys and when, where they came from and where they go, where their eyes wander and how long they look at an item... Then sharing that data with other stores to profile customers, and find out who's sick, pregnant, graduating, on a diet, what political candidates they support... Trac…

Completely agree. It's the sharing that bothers me.

Re: Trackers

#104

Post by dhimes »

roymurdock wrote: post #101
sdoering wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the "good ol' days" (TM the shop-owners in a community knew quite a lot about their customers. Oh Mary just gave birth, Henry is currently sick, Walter likes his coffee a little stronger, James a little weaker (something with his stomach). Danielle drinks only tee, has two kids and the marriage is not really happy. And so on. A lot bordered on gossip, a lot was very valid and relevant information. People talked. S…

I can't think of one website/company that I would like to have this small town clerk-customer relationship with. Youtube's recommended videos are unfailingly terrible, and Amazon's recommended products just feel like annoying add-ons that might "accidentally" get bundled into my cart if I hover my mouse too near them. I generally already have something in mind if I want to buy/watch online. I'll stick with recommenda…

you can browse real people's collections

Wait, what? Do they know that you are browsing? Seems also creepy...

Re: Trackers

#105

Post by imgabe »

sdoering wrote: post #91
davb wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find it interesting that a lot of content producers have feel entitled to users' participation in analytics at all. Sure, it may be frustrating when a user blocks tracking tools (especially self hosted ones) but that's the their choice. We got by for decades without analysing user habits (even in a local only context, without correlation with third party data). There are so few examples of cases where analysing use…

In the "good ol' days" (TM the shop-owners in a community knew quite a lot about their customers. Oh Mary just gave birth, Henry is currently sick, Walter likes his coffee a little stronger, James a little weaker (something with his stomach). Danielle drinks only tee, has two kids and the marriage is not really happy. And so on. A lot bordered on gossip, a lot was very valid and relevant information. People talked. S…

The difference is the customers also knew the same amount about the store owner. Oh, Gerald started running the store when his father got too sick to do it and he's been at it ever since. He's been trying to convince his son to take it up when he retires, but the boy only wants to play guitar, and so on.

There was trust because they were all part of a community. That's not the case with anonymous trackers that people aren't even aware of.

Re: Trackers

#106

Post by jacquesm »

pc86 wrote: post #98
gorhill wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> it is irresponsible, populist and ultimately self-defeating for uBlock and chums to block self-hosted Piwik First, a precision: EasyPrivacy blocks Piwik. uBlock Origin enables EasyPrivacy by default. If you think it's wrong for Piwik to be blocked, bring the issue to EasyPrivacy maintainers. Now, why is it "irresponsible" for Piwik to be blocked? Some of us just do not like to have all our movements scrutinized, ev…

I can understand phone number, but what possible reason is there to refuse to give zip code? The only thing I can think of using that information for is to determine the optimal location to open another store.

Zip code data correlates strongly to wealth.

Re: Trackers

#107

Post by forgottenpass »

sdoering wrote: post #91
davb wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find it interesting that a lot of content producers have feel entitled to users' participation in analytics at all. Sure, it may be frustrating when a user blocks tracking tools (especially self hosted ones) but that's the their choice. We got by for decades without analysing user habits (even in a local only context, without correlation with third party data). There are so few examples of cases where analysing use…

In the "good ol' days" (TM the shop-owners in a community knew quite a lot about their customers. Oh Mary just gave birth, Henry is currently sick, Walter likes his coffee a little stronger, James a little weaker (something with his stomach). Danielle drinks only tee, has two kids and the marriage is not really happy. And so on. A lot bordered on gossip, a lot was very valid and relevant information. People talked. S…

And guess what - everybody benefitted

I grew up in a town with The reason is quite relevant to this thread. The shopkeeper, his wife, and all the regular customers who sat around to chat while they drank their coffee were gossip hounds.

People valued their private lives more than letting a social circle they weren't involved in know anything about them. Not who sent them mail, and not even what type of breakfast cereal they liked.

"Everyone benefitted"? Nah, I think you've just heard too much "small town community" bullshit from politicians.

Re: Trackers

#108

Post by quantumpotato_ »

Doctor_Fegg wrote: post #15

Believe it or not, some stores sympathise with you. They might actually be run by people like you, people who read your story. They still want to know how you proceed round the store, because that helps them optimise shelf layout, identify hard-to-find items, and so on. So yes, they might use the standard in-store CCTV to observe your journeys, and when they figure that you and people like you always have difficulty…

Your second paragraph... that does not apply to grocery stores here in the US.

They fill the center with junk and the fresh food, eggs & milk along the sides. Often eggs & milk (commonly used together) are on OPPOSITE halves of the store!

http://www.grocery411.com/grocery-store-layout.html

Re: Trackers

#109

Post by kelseydh »

dhimes wrote: post #59
davb wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find it interesting that a lot of content producers have feel entitled to users' participation in analytics at all. Sure, it may be frustrating when a user blocks tracking tools (especially self hosted ones) but that's the their choice. We got by for decades without analysing user habits (even in a local only context, without correlation with third party data). There are so few examples of cases where analysing use…

We got by for decades without analysing user habits Depends when you start counting the decades. Since Netscape and the 'coming out' of the www, we've always paid attention to where people go on our own web pages.

Back in the 90's when everybody installed those wacky click counters on their page, it all seemed so innocent...

Re: Trackers

#110

Post by kelseydh »

wouterinho wrote: post #37

It is funny how things change when you use the physical world metaphor. There was a campaign recently by the Dutch regulatory agency that made people aware of the implications of allowing permissions in "free" apps. They made an (anecdotal) video by promising a free cup of coffee in exchange for your contact list on your phone: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AYXM56YJWSo (Dutch unfortunately)

That reminds me a lot of this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F7pYHN9iC9I

Would be great to make one similar combining the two concepts in regards to sharing phone data.

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