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More phones, few banks, instability are transforming Somalia to cashless society

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Re: More phones, few banks, instability are transforming Somalia to cashless society

#41

Post by ximeng »

cup wrote: post #40
ximeng wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No interest from HN or from him?

From HN.

Surprised this would not attract interest - did you raise this previously in another post? Agree with the other replies to your comment, I would have thought there could be considerable interest here if managed correctly. I imagine a brief introductory piece for what the scope of his work is as minister and what he's happy to talk about, posted as an Ask HN with an offer to send questions to the minister directly would be potentially very interesting.

Re: More phones, few banks, instability are transforming Somalia to cashless society

#42

Post by genedickson »

pmontra wrote: post #19

The article is light on details. It looks like EVC is acting as a bank but how do you enter money in the system? Example: I'm going there tomorrow (not really) with a 100 USD bill, then what? It seems I have to buy one of these vouchers http://mogaguide.com/comp_catalog/index.php?ct=1&q=2&in=2&id... I wonder if there is a way to turn what will be left back to cash. In any case, it's not like everybody is its own bank…

I live in California and you are wrong. They use federal reserve notes like everybody else.

Re: More phones, few banks, instability are transforming Somalia to cashless society

#43

Post by genedickson »

The U.S. has been a cashless society for generations. Few people even know what cash is. They think federal reserve notes are cash. They are not. Alaska has cash in circulation and you can spend it at any business, though the scales are out of sight until you break out the cash. They can make change in cash or federal reserve notes. Federal reserve notes are the middle ground between digital currency and cash. I've never seen anyone spend cash in the lower 48. I'm sure that Somali currency is not cash either.

Re: More phones, few banks, instability are transforming Somalia to cashless society

#44

Post by PhasmaFelis »

crusso wrote: post #28
PhasmaFelis wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Indeed. The problem with some hardcore libertarians, among others, is that they want "freedom" to be #1 on Maslow's hierarchy of needs, and become confused or angry when others disagree. If you want people to want freedom--and you should!--you need to start by guaranteeing their basic physical safety and survival. "Live Free or Die" makes for a catchy bumper sticker, but if what you offer is the "freedom" to watch yo…

Your analysis indicates that you're stuck on the dimension of individuality vs collectivism whereby libertarian solutions would somehow be inferior to socialist ones. The real problems in Somalia lie along dimensions of corruption and violence. The biggest gains that they could make as a society would be to reduce the value of corruption and violence as a means to an end. Possibly that reduction comes in the form of…

I'm saying that if you want people to agree with your philosophy, whatever it is, you have to make it relevant to them. Frik seemed to think that Somalians should give up day-to-day security, including financial and physical safety, in order to protect themselves from hypothetical monitoring by a government that currently can't even provide basic law enforcement. In the environment Frik lives in, government monitoring is a reality and frequent robbery is not, and he naively assumes that his priorities can be applied everywhere unchanged.

Re: More phones, few banks, instability are transforming Somalia to cashless society

#45

Post by lisivka »

frik wrote: post #8
witty_username wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Cash is freedom. No one spies on what you do with your cash money. You need to physically visit the other party, so it isn't black and white necessarily the best option. > We can see already with the encryption trojan programs that ask for Bitcoins/altcoins to decrypt your data - something like that wouldn't be reasonable and work on a large scale with cash. Before Bitcoins, it was possible by using wire transfers.…

>> Cash is freedom. No one spies on what you do with your cash money. > You need to physically visit the other party, so it isn't black and white necessarily the best option. Some parties, want to limit cash or downright forbid cash. Then there is no option anymore, think about that. I am all for options and fine with electronic money for web transaction, but removing cash from our society would be a very very bad mo…

Gold is the only real cash. Banknotes are locked us into banks and states. No freedom. Not good.

Re: More phones, few banks, instability are transforming Somalia to cashless society

#46

Post by nommm-nommm »

jsprogrammer wrote: post #35
mschuster91 wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The part about the federal law is still true but as far as I know, law enforcement in Colorado is not required nor can be forced to enforce federal law. But the FBI can very well decide to prosecute federal crimes in states, even if the "crime" is legal under state law.

And a jury can decide that no crime was committed.

The vast majority of cases do not go to trial.

Re: More phones, few banks, instability are transforming Somalia to cashless society

#47

Post by nommm-nommm »

ksec wrote: post #22
frik wrote: post #4

Cash is freedom. No one spies on what you do with your cash money. Hopefully this electronic-only-money utopia won't get traction. We can see already with the encryption trojan programs that ask for Bitcoins/altcoins to decrypt your data - something like that wouldn't be reasonable and work on a large scale with cash.

For those who don't know, there are countries that allows government or companies to take away money from your bank account without your consent if they prove you own them money. I know this may sounds strange and you will properly be thinking that is fine, but there are variety of reasons why you don't want that.

Yes, and your wages can also be garnished if you don't have a bank account so I don't see how cash solves this "problem." And it isn't just companies and governments, individuals also have the power to garnish wages and bank accounts.

Re: More phones, few banks, instability are transforming Somalia to cashless society

#48

Post by nommm-nommm »

Mankhool wrote: post #33
cup wrote: post #18

I know the minister for Telecommunications in Somalia. I asked him to do an AMA on hackernews but there was no interest.

I'm very interested in finding out how to pay people in the third world as well as others with no bank account (10% of Americans don't have one). Please see if he will answer questions. I want to know how it works, how widespread it is in Africa, if they are rolling it out in other countries etc.

What's your questions about Americans without bank accounts? I grew up poor so I knew plenty of people growing up without bank accounts. I can answer most questions.

Re: More phones, few banks, instability are transforming Somalia to cashless society

#49

Post by Pamar »

plesner wrote: post #36
Symbiote wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cash was 40% of transactions, 25% of total value in 2012. [1] Since then, to July 2015, there's been a 25% increase in card payments, but only a 12% increase in total value [2], so smaller things must be being paid for by card. Contactless cards were only introduced in Denmark in 2015, and payment by mobile phone in 2013 [3]. So yes, it's normal. But it's not the most common form of payment, and I've been asked by a…

No question, we're quickly moving away from physical Kroner. There's also political and especially business pressure to get rid of them. However, it's not true that they're obsolete or somehow similar to new yen. I think it's a point worth emphasizing because going cashless is a huge decision, especially the way we're moving towards in Denmark. There's a discussion to be had around it and if we just accept that it's…

I have a question. Suppose I visit Denmark again, and I decide to hire a prostitute. Am I expected to pay by credit card, debit or contactless?

Re: More phones, few banks, instability are transforming Somalia to cashless society

#50

Post by anonbanker »

nommm-nommm wrote: post #47
ksec wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For those who don't know, there are countries that allows government or companies to take away money from your bank account without your consent if they prove you own them money. I know this may sounds strange and you will properly be thinking that is fine, but there are variety of reasons why you don't want that.

Yes, and your wages can also be garnished if you don't have a bank account so I don't see how cash solves this "problem." And it isn't just companies and governments, individuals also have the power to garnish wages and bank accounts.

half of my week has been setting up wage garnishments for people based on liens my customers have filed. I can confirm what the parent says is true in US/Canada/UK/NZ/AU jurisdictions.
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