Live data from Hacker News

Sci-Hub as necessary, effective civil disobedience

bjoern.brembs.net

101–110 of 160 posts

Re: Sci-Hub as necessary, effective civil disobedience

#101

Does Sci-Hub practice what it preaches? Do they provide a means of downloading their entire repository of research papers either via torrent or SFTP? Because if the entire repository isn't available to everyone, then how can we be sure that once they get raided those papers aren't lost forever?

SCi-Hub used hacked or shared university account to abuse the university proxies to get content. For big research institutions, it's an annoyance. To small colleges and university library it is a major headache that can get the whole university locked out from resources the library is paying dearly for. Source: My partner is a librarian at a smaller university, this happens every few months and they lose access to ma…

I feel like you're blaming the wrong party here.

Re: Sci-Hub as necessary, effective civil disobedience

#103

Does Sci-Hub practice what it preaches? Do they provide a means of downloading their entire repository of research papers either via torrent or SFTP? Because if the entire repository isn't available to everyone, then how can we be sure that once they get raided those papers aren't lost forever?

This is an important point that is not getting adequate discussion right now. A couple of days ago, the sight was unavailable for days both on the clear-net and in the dark-web. The sight resurfaced two days ago with two levels of captcha before anyone can search the site. What does this imply? My guess is that the site went down under an automated DDOS. A distributed archive will ameliorate this sort of situation.

Re: Sci-Hub as necessary, effective civil disobedience

#104
post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's no reason to assume a priori that an act is immoral. The primary criterion for an act to be immoral tends to be that it makes someone else's life worse. There is no direct effect of piracy on the author of a work. There is no physical carrier particle for piracy, and no sense organ for "being pirated"; pain receptors do not immediately fire. The indirect effects may include decreased numbers of purchases of c…

When the resource being abused by sci-hub (a university's ezproxy server, via a hacked or shared user account) is shut down by publisher locking out a whole university because an account downloaded 10000 papers over a week-end, there is a real loss. It is not a theoretical moral quandary. Obviously, the loss is kind of abstract for the publisher but it isn't for the small college that spends half or more of its annua…

Why ruined? Can't they just use sci-hub to do their research? ;)

Re: Sci-Hub as necessary, effective civil disobedience

#105
This whole story and the narrative of "civil activist Alexandra Elbakyan" sickens me to no end.

In reality, Alexandra is an avid supporter of Putin's regime and a borderline fascist (in the original sense of cooperative state). Last year, when Dynasty non-profit fund (which sponsored thousands of Russian researchers, mostly in natural sciences) got expelled from Russia because of political reasons, she welcomed it because "they were against Putin". Here is my translation of her words [1][2]:

> [Dynasty] fund is one of the main supporters of "Liberal mission" fund. It supports, develops and advocates "liberal" ideas. In Russian realities it means support of Maidan [Ukrainian revolution], Bolotnaya [location of major protests in Russia in 2012], propaganda against Putin and Russian government.

She hates liberalism and the West in general. To add to the picture, here is what she really thinks about Sci-Hub (context: someone questioned her moral authority) [3][4]:

> We will fight you not only with bans [5], I warn you [6]. … I understand why you are so against Sci-Hub - it's one of the projects that Russia can be proud of and this doesn't fit into your narrative of "everything is bad in Russia". And given that I support the government - it turns into a nightmare for people like you.

So yeah, when I see comparisons like

>Actions of civil disobedience like those of Aaron Swartz and Alexandra Elbakyan

it's very hard not to throw up. No, it isn't "civil disobedience"; she is a complete, utter opposite to civil activists like Aaron Swartz. Sci-Hub is born out of indifference to intellectual property, total invulnerability to lawsuits (Alexandra lives in Russia and Kazakhstan, which aren't aren't very fond of cooperating with US institutions) and poverty of Russian scientists. Yet she manages to see it as a "thing Russia can be proud of".

It is very sad that media picks up the accustomed narrative of activist underdog and completely misses the context of her true views. Doing this, journalists both distort reality and miss a very interesting and provocative story of a statist (and probably somewhat mad) woman which found herself in a right position in a right time to get Western media attention.

[1]: http://vk.com/wall-36928352_2614

[2]: «Так, например, фонд Зимина являлся одним из основных спонсоров фонда «Либеральная миссия». Этот фонд поддерживает, развивает и пропагандирует «либеральную» идею. В Российских реалиях это означает поддержку Майдана, Болотной, пропаганду против Путина и Российской власти.»

[3]: https://vk.com/wall1396880_8792?reply=8796

[4]: «Если потребуется — и не только с помощью банов с вами воевать будем, имейте это ввиду. … Я понимаю, почему вы так против Sci-Hub — ведь это один из проектов, которым может гордиться Россия, и это очень не вписывается в вашу пропаганду о том, как всё в России плохо. А на фоне того, что создатель проекта поддерживает государство — это вообще оборачивается кошмаром для таких, как вы.»

[5]: She bans everyone who even remotely don't support her views in VKontakte Sci-Hub group.

[6]: Yep, it seems like a physical threat in the context. Sorry if I wasn't able to convey it in the translation.

EDIT: formatting, typos

Re: Sci-Hub as necessary, effective civil disobedience

#106
post #49
post #6

I am poor, which I use as my primary excuse to pirate software, movies, books, etc. To those who are not financially struggling: Why do you pirate? What is your moral justification?

Who's not poor here? I have many material goods and earn a lot of money, but I have thousands of debt. I am poor by a lot of criteria. You're not, because you have everything you want by stealing it, you self-declared pirate.

I was assuming that "poor" was defined as approximately equal to or below the USA's poverty line. https://www.healthcare.gov/glossary/federal-poverty-level-FP...

What criteria do you default to when defining the "poor" class?

Re: Sci-Hub as necessary, effective civil disobedience

#107
post #81
post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree, but I think "I'm poor" is better than "I want". Neither completely justifies.

"I'm poor" is only better if you intend to go back and pay for it when you can afford to.

That is illogical.

Your comparison implies that the "rich" pirate eventually pays.

Re: Sci-Hub as necessary, effective civil disobedience

#108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

arXiv? I mean, you're looking at preprints, and you might have a higher dross-to-gold ratio, but can't you do your research there, without the moral dilemma?

arXiv is great, but represents a very small fraction of the total published work, is extremely field specific, and old papers are still very relevant. I find myself regularly relying upon citations from as early as the 1910's. It's not even close to an alternative.

For my PhD thesis I used some papers from the 1800s along with many from the 1900s to 1950s because those were when the foundation papers were published in one area I was working in.

Re: Sci-Hub as necessary, effective civil disobedience

#109
post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is a significant and incredibly poorly defended assertion that you're making there, sir. Given that there are dozens if not hundreds (possibly thousands) of open journals, many of which are heavily digitally based, well tied with distributed storage, and willing to work with any significant publication – the claim that "this plan would likely require significant amounts of additional funding" doesn't even pass t…

Here's how you do a proper smell test - http://bfy.tw/4SY1 It's pretty obvious that there is a revenue stream that disappears when choosing open access over a paid viewing model.. To cover that - when an author publishes a paper and wants to use the open access model, they pay the journal. The costs come from administering peer review. The true cost of publication is unknown - "Diane Sullenberger, executive editor fo…

Another problem with open access journals is that they generally have lower impact factors. The impact factors of the journals you publish in play a big role in tenure and promotion decisions for professors.

Re: Sci-Hub as necessary, effective civil disobedience

#110
post #68

One aspect of Aaron Swartz's case that I found both interesting and way under-reported, was that he supposedly was going to perform meta-analysis against the collected documents. And that a previous meta-analysis of a similar sort had revealed some surprising and useful results. With all the pieces locked up, it is difficult if not impossible to do such science and statistical analysis. In other words, it is antithet…

The Google n-gram project is an example of how one might extract useful information by indexing large numbers of documents. You might, for example, look at trends in the use of a given scientific instrument, or with a bit of NP, when the field switched from using "computer" to mean a machine instead of a person. It was an eye-opener to see how gendered the scientific papers were in the 1960s, where the scientist is i…

See also: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biomedical_text_mining
Post reply on HN