A Message to Our Customers • Hacker News Board

Re: A Message to Our Customers

#831

Post by function_seven » Wed, Feb 17, 2016, 10:04 PM UTC

tgsovlerkhgsel wrote: post #720

function_seven wrote: post #649

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not saying I necessarily agree (or disagree), but the premise is that right now iOS phones are the only ones that do security right, out of the box. They're worth the premium price for that feature. As soon as they no longer have that edge, there's no reason to choose them over any commodity Android device, so sales would drop as they lose their differentiating feature.

Honestly, I doubt that a significant number of people is buying the iPhone for its security features.

Yeah, I don't think so either. Just explaining the parent's line of reasoning.

Re: A Message to Our Customers

#832

Post by guylepage3 » Wed, Feb 17, 2016, 10:05 PM UTC

All of a sudden I'm starting to think my PiPhone is looking pretty good.

Re: A Message to Our Customers

#833

Post by muddi900 » Wed, Feb 17, 2016, 10:08 PM UTC

The court order was posted on HN hours before this letter and eother Tim Cook has not rrad the order or he's lying about the back door. What the court ordered was the removal of the auto-wipe.

Re: A Message to Our Customers

#834

Post by leesalminen » Wed, Feb 17, 2016, 10:10 PM UTC

mapmap wrote: post #827

berkeleynerd wrote: post #779

A friend of mine at Apple reported multiple Black Vehicles (Lincoln Town Cars and Escalades) with at least one having MD License Plates at the Apple Executive Briefing Center this morning between 11AM and Noon. Occupants had ear pieces and sun glasses and were accompanied by a CHP (California Highway Patrol) cruiser and three motorcycle escorts. I suppose it's possible this was a quick (less than 1 hour) VIP stop but…

"I don't want to be deposed" I'm not familiar with that phrase. What does it mean in this context?

A deposition in the American judicial system is a legal proceeding in which a witness provides testimony to the courts. The witness may be examined by members of either sides legal team. This is a routine proceeding in civil cases. [0]

Interestingly, people usually don't want to be deposed when they have something to hide.

[0] http://litigation.findlaw.com/filing-a-lawsuit/what-is-a-dep...

Re: A Message to Our Customers

#835

Post by mintplant » Wed, Feb 17, 2016, 10:11 PM UTC

leesalminen wrote: post #834

mapmap wrote: post #827

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"I don't want to be deposed" I'm not familiar with that phrase. What does it mean in this context?

A deposition in the American judicial system is a legal proceeding in which a witness provides testimony to the courts. The witness may be examined by members of either sides legal team. This is a routine proceeding in civil cases. [0] Interestingly, people usually don't want to be deposed when they have something to hide. [0] http://litigation.findlaw.com/filing-a-lawsuit/what-is-a-dep...

> Interestingly, people usually don't want to be deposed when they have something to hide.

Or because the process is a huge hassle to deal with, it sucks up days and days of your time, and it's very easy to mess something up.

Re: A Message to Our Customers

#836

Post by paraxisi » Wed, Feb 17, 2016, 10:13 PM UTC

leesalminen wrote: post #834

mapmap wrote: post #827

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"I don't want to be deposed" I'm not familiar with that phrase. What does it mean in this context?

A deposition in the American judicial system is a legal proceeding in which a witness provides testimony to the courts. The witness may be examined by members of either sides legal team. This is a routine proceeding in civil cases. [0] Interestingly, people usually don't want to be deposed when they have something to hide. [0] http://litigation.findlaw.com/filing-a-lawsuit/what-is-a-dep...

> Interestingly, people usually don't want to be deposed when they have something to hide.

That's a pretty... er, dubious claim at best?

Re: A Message to Our Customers

#837

Post by dragonwriter » Wed, Feb 17, 2016, 10:14 PM UTC

leesalminen wrote: post #834

mapmap wrote: post #827

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"I don't want to be deposed" I'm not familiar with that phrase. What does it mean in this context?

A deposition in the American judicial system is a legal proceeding in which a witness provides testimony to the courts. The witness may be examined by members of either sides legal team. This is a routine proceeding in civil cases. [0] Interestingly, people usually don't want to be deposed when they have something to hide. [0] http://litigation.findlaw.com/filing-a-lawsuit/what-is-a-dep...

> Interestingly, people usually don't want to be deposed when they have something to hide.

Interestingly, people usually don't want to be deposed, period.

Sure, its a routine proceeding in civil cases; guess what, people generally don't want to be involved in civil cases -- as plaintiffs, defendants, or called witnesses -- either.

Re: A Message to Our Customers

#838

Post by rrmm » Wed, Feb 17, 2016, 10:14 PM UTC

leesalminen wrote: post #834

mapmap wrote: post #827

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"I don't want to be deposed" I'm not familiar with that phrase. What does it mean in this context?

A deposition in the American judicial system is a legal proceeding in which a witness provides testimony to the courts. The witness may be examined by members of either sides legal team. This is a routine proceeding in civil cases. [0] Interestingly, people usually don't want to be deposed when they have something to hide. [0] http://litigation.findlaw.com/filing-a-lawsuit/what-is-a-dep...

Depositions aren't usually that fun regardless of what you have to hide. I'd probably want to avoid one if I had the chance.

Re: A Message to Our Customers

#839

Post by rcthompson » Wed, Feb 17, 2016, 10:14 PM UTC

I see a lot of discussion about "Secure Enclave" and other hardware security features and such, and I'm not sure I see the relevance. Assuming that the data has already been properly encrypted, stored on disk, and purged from memory (by shutting down the phone) by a version of iOS that did not already contain a backdoor when the data was encrypted, there's no magic combination of hardware and software that can decrypt that data without the password, right? This seems to be supported by Apple's claim that the best they could possibly do is provide a channel for the FBI to brute force the password.

So am I missing something that makes the iPhone's internal security architecture relevant here?

Re: A Message to Our Customers

#840

Post by iamdave » Wed, Feb 17, 2016, 10:16 PM UTC

archmikhail wrote: post #814

berkeleynerd wrote: post #779

A friend of mine at Apple reported multiple Black Vehicles (Lincoln Town Cars and Escalades) with at least one having MD License Plates at the Apple Executive Briefing Center this morning between 11AM and Noon. Occupants had ear pieces and sun glasses and were accompanied by a CHP (California Highway Patrol) cruiser and three motorcycle escorts. I suppose it's possible this was a quick (less than 1 hour) VIP stop but…

Save people like me a trip to the Google: NSL = A national security letter (NSL) is an administrative subpoena issued by the United States federal government to gather information for national security purposes. NSLs do not require prior approval from a judge.

IANAL, but how is it a subpoena if it doesn't originate from the judiciary?