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Unilateral Israeli changes to Stuxnet caused its exposure, angering US

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Re: Unilateral Israeli changes to Stuxnet caused its exposure, angering US

#101

Post by guelo »

chx wrote: post #56
jorgecurio wrote: post #6

what confuses me about the US-Israeli relationship is that the most of the times they work well but at times one is always sabatoging each other in a manner that makes you reconsider, is Israel and enemy or a friend to the United States? I don't think Japan would pull off shit like this. It's like there's a four tier system to what defines a US Ally. Platinum - Gets you exclusive access to black funds & latest weapon…

I think you misunderstand the relationship. One, there are civilians, extremely rich civilians who are sending more than a pretty penny to Israel. Two, the US government is essentially bribing the Israel government to stay put and not kill everyone around them. I believe most people vastly underestimate the military might of Israel. Did you know, for example, that Israel has unmanned ground vehicles https://en.wikipe…

That theory doesn't make much sense. If the policy is for preventing Israel from starting wars we wouldn't be bribing them with billions of dollars worth of weapons.

Re: Unilateral Israeli changes to Stuxnet caused its exposure, angering US

#102

Post by obrero »

TheGuyWhoCodes wrote: post #92
cheetos wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Why is Israel being criticized of this when any other country including the UK, France, Germany, Iran, Egypt are doing the same? Because Israel could not do five percent of the things they are doing without the massive amount of military and financial welfare and protection they receive from the USA. The other countries you list do not have that luxury to nearly the same extent.

Massive amount? US foreign aid to Israel is about at most 3% of Israel yearly budget. Most of it Israel has to spend in a specific defined way, mostly buying from US companies. Some go to R&D which are joined operations with the US. Don't forget that Egypt and Jordan get foreign Aid, 1.5B$ while Israel gets 3B$. I don't see any comments on why US should stop it. UK, France, Germany are in NATO which gives them much m…

> Don't forget that Egypt and Jordan get foreign Aid, 1.5B$ while Israel gets 3B$

What? Egypt got no "foreign aid" until some post-Nasserite forces in Egypt got together and decided to kow-tow to Israel and the US during the Camp David accords. For Jordan it is pretty much the same thing, from the attacks on Black September on.

The politicians running these countries were bought off to play nice with Israel. This is more or less openly stated in journals like Foreign Affairs. The money to Egypt and Jordan is money being given indirectly to Israel.

Re: Unilateral Israeli changes to Stuxnet caused its exposure, angering US

#103

Post by noobermin »

BWStearns wrote: post #50

>> The deadly virus >> “changed the code” (the scare quotes bit) >> to invent a “vaccine” >> the secret formula... fell into the hands of Russia and Iran >> increasingly stronger versions of the virus >> the most deadly version of the virus Is anyone else not wild about the manner in which "cyber" articles get written? I feel like non-technical readers are left mildly concerned that they're going to come down with a…

I just chuckled a bit at the name of the documentary: _Zero_Days_

Re: Unilateral Israeli changes to Stuxnet caused its exposure, angering US

#104

Post by 0xffff2 »

cema wrote: post #82
0xffff2 wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it might actually be a pretty good analogy. Doesn't NYC (along with SV and maybe a few other parts of the country) do the same? The NSA staffed only with residents of NYC would probably look very different from the NSA staffed only by residents of the state of Michigan.

I think NSA is mostly staffed with residents of Maryland. Technically.

In the sense that most people move there as part of being hired, yes. The though experiment is to consider the result of restricting recruiting for NSA staff to only NYC/Michigan.

Re: Unilateral Israeli changes to Stuxnet caused its exposure, angering US

#105

Post by obrero »

brightball wrote: post #71
jorgecurio wrote: post #6

what confuses me about the US-Israeli relationship is that the most of the times they work well but at times one is always sabatoging each other in a manner that makes you reconsider, is Israel and enemy or a friend to the United States? I don't think Japan would pull off shit like this. It's like there's a four tier system to what defines a US Ally. Platinum - Gets you exclusive access to black funds & latest weapon…

My guess is that it's probably significantly simpler than that. The US is not threatened by Iran. At all. Israel is threatened by Iran and Iran's leaders have said they would wipe Israel off the map. For Israel, there was probably a greater sense of urgency than the level of patience that we were willing to use.

> Israel is threatened by Iran and Iran's leaders have said they would wipe Israel off the map.

This was not said, it's just Zionist propaganda. Even the Washington Post says so ( https://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/fact-checker/post/did-a... ).

The fact that this lie is repeated over and over shows you how thoroughly Zionist propaganda has propagated through the US media.

Re: Unilateral Israeli changes to Stuxnet caused its exposure, angering US

#106

Post by [deleted] »

TheGuyWhoCodes wrote: post #92
cheetos wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Why is Israel being criticized of this when any other country including the UK, France, Germany, Iran, Egypt are doing the same? Because Israel could not do five percent of the things they are doing without the massive amount of military and financial welfare and protection they receive from the USA. The other countries you list do not have that luxury to nearly the same extent.

Massive amount? US foreign aid to Israel is about at most 3% of Israel yearly budget. Most of it Israel has to spend in a specific defined way, mostly buying from US companies. Some go to R&D which are joined operations with the US. Don't forget that Egypt and Jordan get foreign Aid, 1.5B$ while Israel gets 3B$. I don't see any comments on why US should stop it. UK, France, Germany are in NATO which gives them much m…

[deleted]

Re: Unilateral Israeli changes to Stuxnet caused its exposure, angering US

#107

Post by throwaway27_35 »

obrero wrote: post #102
TheGuyWhoCodes wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Massive amount? US foreign aid to Israel is about at most 3% of Israel yearly budget. Most of it Israel has to spend in a specific defined way, mostly buying from US companies. Some go to R&D which are joined operations with the US. Don't forget that Egypt and Jordan get foreign Aid, 1.5B$ while Israel gets 3B$. I don't see any comments on why US should stop it. UK, France, Germany are in NATO which gives them much m…

> Don't forget that Egypt and Jordan get foreign Aid, 1.5B$ while Israel gets 3B$ What? Egypt got no "foreign aid" until some post-Nasserite forces in Egypt got together and decided to kow-tow to Israel and the US during the Camp David accords. For Jordan it is pretty much the same thing, from the attacks on Black September on. The politicians running these countries were bought off to play nice with Israel. This is…

"until some post-Nasserite forces in Egypt got together and decided to kow-tow to Israel and the US during the Camp David accords" Youre describing the camp david accord as if some jewish cabal took control of the administration of egypt. Egypt simply realized life would be better if it didn't go to war with a formidable enemy every 5 years (that is literally the average from 1948-Yom Kippur War in 1973), and it left the soviet orbit and aligned itself more the US.

>No foreign aid http://www.history.com/this-day-in-history/united-states-wit... and it was even offered during your hero Nasser's regime

Re: Unilateral Israeli changes to Stuxnet caused its exposure, angering US

#108

Post by TheGuyWhoCodes »

obrero wrote: post #102
TheGuyWhoCodes wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Massive amount? US foreign aid to Israel is about at most 3% of Israel yearly budget. Most of it Israel has to spend in a specific defined way, mostly buying from US companies. Some go to R&D which are joined operations with the US. Don't forget that Egypt and Jordan get foreign Aid, 1.5B$ while Israel gets 3B$. I don't see any comments on why US should stop it. UK, France, Germany are in NATO which gives them much m…

> Don't forget that Egypt and Jordan get foreign Aid, 1.5B$ while Israel gets 3B$ What? Egypt got no "foreign aid" until some post-Nasserite forces in Egypt got together and decided to kow-tow to Israel and the US during the Camp David accords. For Jordan it is pretty much the same thing, from the attacks on Black September on. The politicians running these countries were bought off to play nice with Israel. This is…

Egypt gets Foreign Aid since 79', Jordan got economic and military aid since 1951 and 1957, respectively. Black September started on 6 September 1970.

I agree with you they were bought off, but was it better for them to be at a constant war with Israel?

> The money to Egypt and Jordan is money being given indirectly to Israel I'd very much would like an explanation on this.

Re: Unilateral Israeli changes to Stuxnet caused its exposure, angering US

#109

Post by throwaway27_35 »

nathanlied wrote: post #27
ryanlol wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The sheer arrogance with with $country operates is just something else.

Not all countries would be included there. The US? Russia? North Korea? Sure. Finland? Iceland? Not so much. There is something to be said about a country's foreign policy and how 'arrogant' it is. A country can have a solid foreign policy (read: not be a pushover) and still not act like a giant bully.

Someone else has pointed this out elsewhere but it's a bit odd to compare israel to scandanavian countries rather than the middle eastern countries that surround it.

So let's ask the same question again: is Israel's behavior arrogant? Possibly, but not really when compared to Iran, Saudi Arabia, Turkey, Syria or Qatar

Re: Unilateral Israeli changes to Stuxnet caused its exposure, angering US

#110

Post by 13thLetter »

obrero wrote: post #99
gadders wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or maybe people think that Israel is the only liberal democracy in the middle east and surrounded by nations and terrorist organisations that want to wipe it out.

> only liberal democracy in the middle east What a laugh. A Palestinian in Hebron whose family has been there for thousands of years gets no vote, whereas a Jew from Brooklyn who just got off a plane and steals his land does get a vote in the Knesset. This is a democracy? How deluded do you think we all are?

The Palestinian in Hebron doesn't have a vote because the PLO -- after fighting, and losing, several explicit wars of genocide against Israel -- explicitly refuses to negotiate a settlement or accept a peace offer. If you're upset about that poor family in Hebron, you need to write to Ramallah, not Jerusalem.

> whereas a Jew from Brooklyn who just got off a plane and steals his land

Let's hear more details about your narrative where a perfidous Jew can just climb on an airplane today, fly to Israel, point at an arbitrary plot of land in the West Bank and take it away from its current owner.

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