Python is the new BASIC these days.
Ask HN: Is Python dying?
111–120 of 369 posts
Re: Ask HN: Is Python dying?
#112Earlier quoted context omitted.
GP has argued otherwise. PyPI sampling is not random. It is heavily influenced by automatic downloads and such and completely ignores that most simple 2.x libs / non-3.3-tagged libs will work just fine on python 3. In other words, it is neither random nor representative of python 3 usage, failing the premise you yourself mentioned. There's no easy way to determine Python 3 usage overall. Your best bet is to go around…
...it is neither random nor representative of python 3 usage, failing the premise you yourself mentioned. I'm not arguing the py2 vs py3 band wagon; all I'm saying is that if you choose to dispute the validity of statistics you need to do it properly, not just with 'those stats aren't any good because [arbitrary speculative reason 1] [arbitrary speculative reason 2]'. Can you actually justify these assertions? Or are…
> You know what they're going to say already, without even asking?
Yes:
- It has been done before
- I've been around the Python ecosystem a long time and I know a lot of its users (a random sample, if you will)
- I spent several years freelancing as a Python dev which gave me the occasion to do exactly that. While that is not a representative sample on its own, my data matches up with the rest.
But all things aside, you really need to check your damn attitude at the door. I neither like nor dislike the results. The facts that matter are that Python 3 has a great ecosystem today and that is what matters to me; not whether my neighbour uses Python 1, 2, 3 or PHP.
Re: Ask HN: Is Python dying?
#113http://www.simplyhired.com/search?q=python Showing 1-10 of 169,970 Python jobs http://www.simplyhired.com/search?q=ruby Showing 1-10 of 128,305 Ruby jobs http://www.simplyhired.com/search?q=java Showing 1-10 of 190,126 Java jobs http://www.simplyhired.com/search?q=golang Showing 1-10 of 219 Golang jobs http://www.simplyhired.com/search?q=julia Showing 1-10 of 206 Julia jobs http://www.simplyhired.com/search?q=%22pyth…
http://www.simplyhired.com/search?q=perl Showing 1-10 of 220,528 Perl jobs And you know, Perl is dead. Basically, Python gave a choice to a lot of people to either invest time into 3.x without any important improvements or to keep using 2.7 and invest time playing with other languages. Which in turn accelerated Python's decline and raised questions about it dying, promoting the idea even more. But there is no need to…
The exact same could be said about Perl 6 ;)
Re: Ask HN: Is Python dying?
#114Reading HN, you'd think Java was dying (dead?) too. But it's not. It's an established language with a lot of very senior people still using it. It has it's issues for sure, but it also has a ton of libraries and support. Python I'd say is in a similar boat. Strong and established with tons of libraries, not popular amongst the kids. Edit: Apparently my use of "kids" as a sarcastic way of referring to those who won't…
What? The kids? I see young people using python more than any other language by FAR. What region are you? I've seen this through the northeast and midwest United States.
Second this. Python is just the perfect language for concept proving or prototyping.
Re: Ask HN: Is Python dying?
#115My suggestion is not to ask not whether your favorite language is dying. Ask why you are so worried about that.
If you plan a career of any length of time technology you will have to up sticks and move to new language countless times. In fact, in some ways doing that is one of your core skills. Embrace it and enjoy it. Perfect your ability to digest and consume a new language complete with its idiomatic quirks and warts and its various ecosystem of tools and frameworks.
In terms of a choice of a language for an actual project, Python is so established that there is basically zero risk in starting a project in Python now. There is exactly zero chance that it's going to be abandoned and you will be left without a viable community of support any time in the next decade. So if Python solves your problem today just use it.
Re: Ask HN: Is Python dying?
#116Despite some rifts in the community around 2 vs 3 versions, Python is still widely used, no worries.
My take is Python 3 has done more damage to community than we accept to recognise. Python 3 has taken a strong academic approach to make the language better while being valid made it feels like a regression compared to Python 2. The 'print "abc"' not working anymore without brackets is a good example of it.
Re: Ask HN: Is Python dying?
#117Python is dying in much the same way that C is dying, and by that I mean it's not dying at all. I'm no expert on Go or JS but Julia is not even close to being a serious competitor to Python for data science right now. Besides, Julia has a role more similar to R than Python.
I think C and even C++ are basically dead from a job market perspective but seem alive and doing ok in the opensource community. The need for paid C development pales in comparison to the job market for python. The industry, at least outside HN, for "backend" type work has settled on java/.net languages. They are just good enough for 95% of use cases and easy enough to hire for.
AFAIK, for a competitive backend programmers, besides C++/Java, good at least one script language(tool) is a must, let it be bash/perl/Python, etc... More and more people are picking up Python for this role, simply because it is more a complete package than its competitors.
I do agree with you, knowing ONLY Python is not really something to feel good at, but same thing can be said for any other programming language...
Re: Ask HN: Is Python dying?
#118That may be a view through the distorted HN lenses. Spend some time on Lambda the Ultimate and you'll think imperative programming is dying. Go is new and has lots of issues. It's annoying on many fronts and badly needs improvements in packaging area. It's good for some things and worse for others. JS is for frontend, because it's the only supported language. (although there are python-to-js compilers available if yo…
My prediction is that one day some alternative Python interpreter (Stackless, or GIL-less, or which compiles ahead of time to machine code, or something like that) will go from being merely an interesting concept to a dominant runtime. Python is such an excellent language, and it only has a small handful of elements holding it back from being even better. I feel like eventually something has to give, and either there will be a radical new official Python runtime, or an alternative one that becomes the de-facto standard (Pypy, Jython, Cython, Stackless, etc).
Or maybe that's just wishful thinking. I just want it to be so.
Re: Ask HN: Is Python dying?
#119Not only is Python not dying, but it's stronger than it's ever been. The majority of top colleges are now teaching CS using Python. It's completely dominant in academia, finance, and startups. It has the best libraries and documentation of any language. And Django has arguably the strongest community of any open source project period. That's not to say there are zero problems, but Python is so much better than all th…
Completely dominant in finance? Do you have a source for that claim?
Re: Ask HN: Is Python dying?
#120Earlier quoted context omitted.
...it is neither random nor representative of python 3 usage, failing the premise you yourself mentioned. I'm not arguing the py2 vs py3 band wagon; all I'm saying is that if you choose to dispute the validity of statistics you need to do it properly, not just with 'those stats aren't any good because [arbitrary speculative reason 1] [arbitrary speculative reason 2]'. Can you actually justify these assertions? Or are…
> You know what they're going to say already, without even asking? Yes: - It has been done before - I've been around the Python ecosystem a long time and I know a lot of its users (a random sample, if you will) - I spent several years freelancing as a Python dev which gave me the occasion to do exactly that. While that is not a representative sample on its own, my data matches up with the rest. But all things aside,…
I'm not interested in the health of the python3 ecosystem at all.
My only point is, was and remains, that statistics are more complicated than simply 'those statistics do not match my personal perception of things'; justify your argument with actual data.
I'd would be interested to see any alternative stats on the subject you care to link to.