Trade Officials Sign the TPP but It's Still Up to Lawmakers to Reject It
1–10 of 29 posts
Re: Trade Officials Sign the TPP but It's Still Up to Lawmakers to Reject It
#2TPP is obscured by a wall of confusion and disinformation. As a tax payer of the United States (or any other country involved), what do you think the takeaway is? As in, how should I, a concerned citizen, approach this topic at the bar or the dinner table?
Re: Trade Officials Sign the TPP but It's Still Up to Lawmakers to Reject It
#3TPP is obscured by a wall of confusion and disinformation. As a tax payer of the United States (or any other country involved), what do you think the takeaway is? As in, how should I, a concerned citizen, approach this topic at the bar or the dinner table?
>a concerned citizen, approach this topic at the bar or the dinner table?
One argument is : Tell them how their software (games, anything with DRM) spies on their kids and can harm them for life (insurance, job prospects, etc). Present it like this: Companies determine kid has X,y, z trait, their names (just by being connected they can do this with math and correlating other consumer data) then that kid is filtered out of companies/schools that he may want to apply to. Note that universities/corporations can pay to use services to filter out applications using analytics. AKA your equality of opportunity disappears when they can know everything about you and screen you out.
Corporations buy and sell information it's in things like EULA's on videogames that they can collect and infer all sorts of things by how much time you spend on the internet and also track your location.
Another argument : Make it about repairing everyday things, and how IP law is making us wasteful/harming the environment by forcing "waste" model of consumption. Basically corporations are trying to undermine our everyday rights by using intellectual property and copyright laws... to con us out of our right to own products and have them made fairly because we're 100's of miles away from corporations we can't 'storm the gate'.
Say old ages you want to fix an engine or repair the car yourself, there will be all these bullshit IP laws in the way.
Check out the "DRM" coffee maker.
https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20140227/06521826371/keuri...
Basically they want us to rent everything perpetually never own it... I'd love to make a meme out of "You wouldn't repair your engine would you? That would infringe someones intellectual(or insultingly imagiinary) property".
You can think of better examples but they are radically all trying to undermine our ability to own and repair stuff by controlling our governments laws.
The best way to fight back is to find ways to humor and disparage it and at the same time point out the fraud, and find easy examples effect peoples lives, purposely push the envelope and imagine the worst as well because people aren't rational, so push their buttons and find whatever works.
Note this racket/fraud has been going on for over 100 years now.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copyright_Term_Extension_Act#/...
Re: Trade Officials Sign the TPP but It's Still Up to Lawmakers to Reject It
#4The EFF obviously is focused on one aspect of the deal, and I don't find their arguments about the other aspects to be convincing. For the economic benefits, they use the same form of argument that global warming skeptics and creationists do, observing that there exists people who disagree with the general consensus. The fact that they can name one researcher on both sides of the issue does not imply that we should dismiss that issue as "debatable."
The fact of the matter is that "the agreement would reduce 18,000 tariffs. Tariffs on all U.S. manufactured goods and almost all U.S. farm products would be eliminated completely, with most eliminations occurring immediately." [1] Furthermore, we can't realistically ask for the parties to go back to the negotiating table to try to improve the deal. This one was 10 years in the making, which is depressing, but does mean that it's basically this deal or nothing.
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trans-Pacific_Partnership#Tari...
Re: Trade Officials Sign the TPP but It's Still Up to Lawmakers to Reject It
#5The EFF obviously is focused on one aspect of the deal, and I don't find their arguments about the other aspects to be convincing. For the economic benefits, they use the same form of argument that global warming skeptics and creationists do, observing that there exists people who disagree with the general consensus. The fact that they can name one researcher on both sides of the issue does not imply that we should d…
Reducing tariffs is not in vogue anymore. Trump is getting lots of support for his proposal to reinstate many tariffs.
>Furthermore, we can't realistically ask for the parties to go back to the negotiating table to try to improve the deal. This one was 10 years in the making, which is depressing, but does mean that it's basically this deal or nothing.
But they told us that negotiating it in secrecy does not matter as there will be a window of so many months in which it will be made public before the legislators will sign it.
So then it does matter, after all.
Re: Trade Officials Sign the TPP but It's Still Up to Lawmakers to Reject It
#6There is only one candidate that is addressing TPP.
Stephen Miller, Donald Trump senior economic adviser discusses his policy here
https://soundcloud.com/breitbart/breitbart-news-daily-stephe...
Re: Trade Officials Sign the TPP but It's Still Up to Lawmakers to Reject It
#7The EFF obviously is focused on one aspect of the deal, and I don't find their arguments about the other aspects to be convincing. For the economic benefits, they use the same form of argument that global warming skeptics and creationists do, observing that there exists people who disagree with the general consensus. The fact that they can name one researcher on both sides of the issue does not imply that we should d…
Michael Geist covered many more issues with TPP here:
Re: Trade Officials Sign the TPP but It's Still Up to Lawmakers to Reject It
#8The EFF obviously is focused on one aspect of the deal, and I don't find their arguments about the other aspects to be convincing. For the economic benefits, they use the same form of argument that global warming skeptics and creationists do, observing that there exists people who disagree with the general consensus. The fact that they can name one researcher on both sides of the issue does not imply that we should d…
> The EFF obviously is focused on one aspect of the deal
So ? A chain is as strong as it's weakest link. If one aspect of the deal is unacceptable then there is no point in discussing the rest, you can reject the whole deal.
Re: Trade Officials Sign the TPP but It's Still Up to Lawmakers to Reject It
#9TPP is obscured by a wall of confusion and disinformation. As a tax payer of the United States (or any other country involved), what do you think the takeaway is? As in, how should I, a concerned citizen, approach this topic at the bar or the dinner table?
Ignore it. You can't change the outcome anyway :-|
Re: Trade Officials Sign the TPP but It's Still Up to Lawmakers to Reject It
#10The EFF obviously is focused on one aspect of the deal, and I don't find their arguments about the other aspects to be convincing. For the economic benefits, they use the same form of argument that global warming skeptics and creationists do, observing that there exists people who disagree with the general consensus. The fact that they can name one researcher on both sides of the issue does not imply that we should d…
> The EFF obviously is focused on one aspect of the deal So ? A chain is as strong as it's weakest link. If one aspect of the deal is unacceptable then there is no point in discussing the rest, you can reject the whole deal.
I don't understand your use of the chain analogy. The TPP is wide-ranging agreement. How are the economic benefits of reduced tariffs eliminated by another aspect of the deal, such as copyrights?