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Zenefits Software Helped Brokers Cheat On Licensing Process

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Re: Zenefits Software Helped Brokers Cheat On Licensing Process

#91

Post by conorh »

unethical_ban wrote: post #41
uptown wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, it should absolutely be up to the individual to decide whether they've met the legal requirements for their job. I hope my surgeons self-certify that they're ready to operate, and the technician that repairs the airline I'm flying on should have the last word on whether he's qualified to start tinkering with the ailerons!

If, after 8 years of med school, your surgeon had to sit through a 2 hour video made 15 years ago about "The importance of surgery" and "where to keep the scalpels", he's probably be a bit frustrated.

You've pretty much described what happens when a surgeon joins a hospital. Well perhaps that is an exaggeration, but my wife sat through several required classes on basic procedures before starting her surgery job. Hospitals, like any dysfunctional bureaucracy driven partially by lawyers, thrive on this stuff.

Re: Zenefits Software Helped Brokers Cheat On Licensing Process

#92

Post by [deleted] »

pinewurst wrote: post #72
exw wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While there may or may not be a darker side to having an entire engineering team in the 25-30 age range, according to the reporter that wrote the article, this hacking came straight from the CEO, who also set the tone for this type of behavior: https://twitter.com/williamalden/status/697898496314077185 >

I realize it's the law, but that is an interesting question. I'm a page-at-a-glance reader (not to brag) and sitting in front of something for 52 hours would make me feel like a character from "Harrison Bergeron".

[deleted]

Re: Zenefits Software Helped Brokers Cheat On Licensing Process

#93

Post by wiseleo »

I took pre-license training while developing some software for insurance brokers to better understand their industry.

There is not enough material there to spend 52 hours studying. You spend 12 hours on code and ethics, 20 hours on life, and 20 hours on medical.

The material is very simple. The hourly requirement is based on the offline classroom, but should be compressed for online learning.

Re: Zenefits Software Helped Brokers Cheat On Licensing Process

#94

Post by bishnu »

mixmastamyk wrote: post #22
tyre wrote: post #16

I used to work at Gusto (ZenPayroll back in my day) and dealing with Zenefits was always a pain for this reason. They were the consummate hackers, using screen scraping and automation to do whatever the hell they wanted. One nightmare example was when a bug in their "automated" system rewrote bank account information for tons of employees to just be the last 4 digits of their account number. Such a mess. Even if this…

> uncovering some frightening immaturity pervasive in Valley companies. This is one of the dark sides to having an entire engineering team in the 25-30 age range. They can sling http just fine, but sometimes don't fully grasp the consequences of their work.

I'm not sure how age-related this is.

The Valley has started to equate "disruption" with breaking the law. This is its natural consequence.

Re: Zenefits Software Helped Brokers Cheat On Licensing Process

#95

Post by [deleted] »

jacquesm wrote: post #42
jasode wrote: post #3

Another source[1] had more info about " The Macro ": Many of our California sales representatives received access to a software tool called a “Macro” that may have allowed them to complete mandatory online pre-licensing education courses offered by a third-party test preparation provider in less than the legally required 52 total hours. The Macro functioned to keep a person logged into the course and prevented the pe…

Sounds to me like the real problem was in the test. If someone can get by without actually absorbing the material then they should be given the pass, if they can't then it's a different story. Of course as soon as the program starts answering test questions or something like that it is a different matter but to spend less time than required and still pass means that either the test is inadequate or the course is need…

[deleted]

Re: Zenefits Software Helped Brokers Cheat On Licensing Process

#96

Post by x0x0 »

igurari wrote: post #82
x0x0 wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

because I remembered reading it, there's a wee bit more to the story than Ben shares. It took a while to find it since Bloomberg reorganized their site [1] but here you go [2]. tl;dr: what Sharlene really went to jail for was more than shifting grant dates around (some by more than 60 days, which is more than a month last time I checked.) She appears to have changed grant and exercise dates both to increase income an…

Ben doesn't share that backstory, but it's irrelevant to his point. He is suggesting that he might have gone to jail by association with her and having done something illegal at his own company. Hence his statement: "Since we had the same head of finance, we almost certainly would have been investigated.... The whole thing was a case of the old saying: “When the paddy wagon pulls up to the house of ill repute, it doe…

No.

She did not go to jail for option grant backdating. She paid a fine for option grant backdating.

If you were honest with your auditors and did not lie to the SEC, you generally had at most an enforcement action and income restatement.

https://www.sec.gov/spotlight/optionsbackdating.htm

Re: Zenefits Software Helped Brokers Cheat On Licensing Process

#97

Post by spacehome »

jacquesm wrote: post #42
jasode wrote: post #3

Another source[1] had more info about " The Macro ": Many of our California sales representatives received access to a software tool called a “Macro” that may have allowed them to complete mandatory online pre-licensing education courses offered by a third-party test preparation provider in less than the legally required 52 total hours. The Macro functioned to keep a person logged into the course and prevented the pe…

Sounds to me like the real problem was in the test. If someone can get by without actually absorbing the material then they should be given the pass, if they can't then it's a different story. Of course as soon as the program starts answering test questions or something like that it is a different matter but to spend less time than required and still pass means that either the test is inadequate or the course is need…

Or there's a wide spectrum in people's ability to learn.

The real issue is that there is a designated time at all rather than just a test.

Re: Zenefits Software Helped Brokers Cheat On Licensing Process

#99

Post by SteveGerencser »

mixmastamyk wrote: post #22
tyre wrote: post #16

I used to work at Gusto (ZenPayroll back in my day) and dealing with Zenefits was always a pain for this reason. They were the consummate hackers, using screen scraping and automation to do whatever the hell they wanted. One nightmare example was when a bug in their "automated" system rewrote bank account information for tons of employees to just be the last 4 digits of their account number. Such a mess. Even if this…

> uncovering some frightening immaturity pervasive in Valley companies. This is one of the dark sides to having an entire engineering team in the 25-30 age range. They can sling http just fine, but sometimes don't fully grasp the consequences of their work.

I wish it was just the 20 something programmer that did this. I know more than a few 40 somethings that never evolved out of the good enough phase of development. They can't even be bothered to test their own code before hitting submit. Everything is just a small bug that can be easily fixed later.
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