Why expat Americans are giving up their passports • Hacker News Board

Re: Why expat Americans are giving up their passports

#141

Post by Vespasian » Wed, Feb 10, 2016, 12:58 PM UTC

masklinn wrote: post #93

cheatdeath wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That list is out of date - there's an updated version on wikipedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Visa_(document)#Visa_restricti... Not sure if "powerful" is the right word either. It's more of a list of the best passports to have if you want to go on holidays. "Doesn't require a visa" usually means those countries don't require visas for short non-business trips (anything from 14 days to 6 months). E.g. you can visi…

> E.g. you can visit the US with a German passport for 3 months for a holiday but it's extremely difficult to get a visa to move there indefinitely. You do realise that works the same way for everybody and US visa-free entry is not a residence permit right? For instance as a US citizen you'd get visa-free entry to Iceland or Japan or New Zealand but can only stay for 90 days.

Well it works that way for everybody with a "good" passport. This is why the list is there in the first place ;)

Things get a lot more difficult if you have for example an Egyptian passport.

Re: Why expat Americans are giving up their passports

#142

Post by MikeNomad » Wed, Feb 10, 2016, 12:58 PM UTC

Doesn't the "I" in "I.R.S." stand for "Internal?"

Re: Why expat Americans are giving up their passports

#143

Post by marcosdumay » Wed, Feb 10, 2016, 12:58 PM UTC

personlurking wrote: post #88

> "The United States is one of only two countries in the world that has citizenship-based taxation (the other is Eritrea)." I very recently read that Brazil does this too - that no matter where you currently live or work, as a Brazilian citizen, you have to pay taxes on it to Brazil (someone correct me if I'm wrong)

You have to pay taxes on any income you earn on Brazil, even if you don't live here.

You don't have to pay taxes on income taxed afar, even if you live here, and on any income not earned here if you live afar.

Re: Why expat Americans are giving up their passports

#144

Post by briandear » Wed, Feb 10, 2016, 12:58 PM UTC

bespoke_engnr wrote: post #71

timthelion wrote: post #24

I am an American living in Prague and will be among those to give up their citizenship. The new FBAR requirements and the recently pushed through changes that require foreign banks to report are really a huge burden. It is a significant legal risk to be an American overseas. The fines are insane for failiure to report, even if you owe no taxes! You can easilly land yourself with a $20 000 - $80 000 fine for having a…

I'm an American living in Europe. I report my income to the IRS every year, like you. Reading your comment gave me a scare -- what exactly would trigger the $20,000-80,000 fine or asset seizure? Is it a failure to report income taxes at all? Or do you make so much more than $100k/year that the double taxation is killing you? I'm just trying to figure out what, other than their already-reported income being audited, h…

The Foreign Earned Income exclusion does not apply to capital gains, investment or any other "unearned income." So a retired person would by able to claim the FEIE exclusion -- they'd be taxed as if they lived in the United States (with deductions for foreign taxes paid.) Pensions, disability payments, annuity payouts.. not under the FEIE. So for a lower-income retired person, double taxation is a huge problem.

Re: Why expat Americans are giving up their passports

#145

Post by sschueller » Wed, Feb 10, 2016, 1:00 PM UTC

arto wrote: post #16

Swizec wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Does it have such a premium? Having an EU passport works preeeetty well too.

Indeed: https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/top-10-most-powerful-passport...

Does this list include countries that the US doesn't let you travel to without permission from the state dept.?

Re: Why expat Americans are giving up their passports

#146

Post by [deleted] » Wed, Feb 10, 2016, 1:01 PM UTC

cpursley wrote: post #64

madaxe_again wrote: post #17

So, I know a us born billionaire who rescinded his citizenship last year to avoid fatca. He has successfully evaded both the US and UK tax authorities to the tune of half a billion or so, he tells me. The guy gives crazy amounts to philanthropic causes instead. He doesn't want his hard earned wealth pissed away by clueless bureaucrats. So. Anyone who tells you fatca has been a success is full of it. It penalises "nor…

> The guy gives crazy amounts to philanthropic causes instead. This. As a someone who leans libertarian, folks give me the "you must be greedy" look when I mention that I have an issue with income taxation. Not at all - like your friend, I'm rather selective about where I donate my money - to causes that matter to me. I'm a generous person and consider the coercion of the state to be neither altruistic nor efficient.

[deleted]

Re: Why expat Americans are giving up their passports

#147

Post by klunger » Wed, Feb 10, 2016, 1:02 PM UTC

timthelion wrote: post #24

I am an American living in Prague and will be among those to give up their citizenship. The new FBAR requirements and the recently pushed through changes that require foreign banks to report are really a huge burden. It is a significant legal risk to be an American overseas. The fines are insane for failiure to report, even if you owe no taxes! You can easilly land yourself with a $20 000 - $80 000 fine for having a…

I am an American in Norway...

I thought you only had to file FATCA for bank accounts that had more than $10,000 USD in them at some point in the past year. Not a few hundred. Are you sure about that? (if so, oh sh*t)

Re: Why expat Americans are giving up their passports

#148

Post by mpweiher » Wed, Feb 10, 2016, 1:02 PM UTC

Ovid wrote: post #60

rtpg wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To my knowledge there's treaties with the vast majority of countries to avoid double taxation if you're not making more than a very large amount of money ( filed taxes last year and ended up with a giant goose egg)

Actually, no. The US has tax treaties with roughly 1/3rd of the countries in the world (source: https://www.irs.gov/Businesses/International-Businesses/Unit... ). If you're not in one of those countries, too bad. Further, these tax treaties differ from country to country and don't always offer the same protections. Here, read the 42 page US/France tax treaty ( https://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-trty/france.pdf ) and try to…

> We're normal people who are being massively screwed by rhetoric in the US.

Yup. Same goes for normal people who move the other way. The anti-foreign(er) consensus in the US political system/debate is almost as bad as the "tough on crime" madness.

And of course that's reflected in what people think. I remember being in a discussion after an interesting EE380 session (so not exactly bottom of the pile) and one of the guys started ranting about the evils of H1Bs driving down wages. I mentioned I was on an H1B and that what he said was illegal. He asked me how much I made, I asked him to guess. He mentioned a number. I said "multiply by at least 3". He kind of shut up after that...

Re: Why expat Americans are giving up their passports

#149

Post by rayiner » Wed, Feb 10, 2016, 1:03 PM UTC

mike_hearn wrote: post #135

rayiner wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My dad was evacuated from Yemen by the military when the civil war there broke out. That blue passport was his ticket out of a country that was rapidly disintegrating. He was not charged anything for that. So they don't always charge you (indeed I've never heard of it).

http://www.latimes.com/world/middleeast/la-fg-yemen-us-citiz... http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/16061379-post8.html

My dad was evacuated 15-20 years ago. Before that, Yemen was a poor but pretty peaceful country. I think we should evacuate the folks stuck there now, but the state department isn't wrong to say that they've had a lot of notice and shouldn't have been there in the first place.

Re: Why expat Americans are giving up their passports

#150

Post by tankenmate » Wed, Feb 10, 2016, 1:05 PM UTC

jacquesm wrote: post #22

dalke wrote: post #9

American citizens have to pay $2,350 to renounce citizenship? What kind of paperwork costs that much? (Or, why not just add more paperwork and charge $100K?) http://www.greenbacktaxservices.com/blog/renouncing-us-citiz... > 1. Consular officers must confirm that the potential renunciant fully understands the consequences of renunciation, including losing the right to reside in the United States without documentation…

That sounds about as hard as cancelling comcast.

Given some of the stories of phone calls to Comcast's cancellation departments it sounds like renouncing your US citizenship is easier, but definitely more expensive.