Earlier quoted context omitted.
My current residence was built in 1890 and I would not consider it 'hopelessly outdated' or in need of rebuilding.
Similarly, my home is from the early 1800s and my parents house was first built in the 1600s, but most of the current part was built in the early 1700s. Both of these houses are perfectly functional and warm, and barely use that much more energy than most modern houses (we've insulated them well and use efficient lighting etc). And yes they do have inside toilets ;) I guess housing stock in the UK is just much older.
A house that costs $20k
181–190 of 212 posts
Re: A house that costs $20k
#182Earlier quoted context omitted.
Rent does not build wealth. Rent is the act of transferring wealth from the poor to the rich. Rent is, essentially, theft from society itself, it leaves everyone poorer when most people rent. Rent in America today is identical to the serfs of old. The post-WW2 thing the Government did with getting everyone mortgages so they would be home owners that caused the eventual economic collapse 10 years ago? They had the rig…
>Rent in America today is identical to the serfs of old. Instead ... make everyone fiscally responsible so that getting a mortgage wouldn't be hard for them in the first place. Replace rent with debt is your solution? Mortgages (banks) are the new feudal lords
Re: A house that costs $20k
#183Earlier quoted context omitted.
Lifespan of a mobile home is estimated at 30-55 years depending on area and on how much upkeep the owner does. There's also a huge stigma around living in a mobile home, and serious logistics involved in hauling the mobile home to its final destination as it has to be delivered in one or two pieces on a long flatbed trailer.
I've also seen something years ago where a house is made from components that come from a manufacturing facility -- each one can be hauled in on a flatbed. But when they are all assembled, the result really looks and functions like a regular house.
Part of what makes them attractive is that the assembly on your lot goes really quickly, so the chance of exposure to damaging weather (and thieves/vandals) goes way down compared to traditional homes.
Re: A house that costs $20k
#184Earlier quoted context omitted.
Rent does not build wealth. Rent is the act of transferring wealth from the poor to the rich. Rent is, essentially, theft from society itself, it leaves everyone poorer when most people rent. Rent in America today is identical to the serfs of old. The post-WW2 thing the Government did with getting everyone mortgages so they would be home owners that caused the eventual economic collapse 10 years ago? They had the rig…
Renting gives people who already have a home incentive to build new housing. It also allows you to live somewhere without (a) tying up all my capital + credit in some super-undiversified equity[1] and (b) buying a massive amount of downside risk on the local property market. The comparison with serfs is, I think, an example of the worst argument in the world[2], paying someone for use of their property seems fine to…
I doubt that's something that's actually needed. There's already plenty of incentive for that.
Re: A house that costs $20k
#185Earlier quoted context omitted.
> In a functioning market rents bring in just a tiny bit more than the monthly mortgage payment, including taxes and fees. Which means rent is still transferring money from the poor to the rich. If you have a mortgage, you're hopefully building up equity that can be released when you retire to somewhere smaller or in a cheaper location (which you can do, since you don't need to live near jobs and any kids will have m…
Which means rent is still transferring money from the poor to the rich. If you have a mortgage, you're hopefully building up equity Have you seen what percentage of your mortgage payment is equity early on? You're lucky if it's 5%. The rest is interest that goes to the "rich". Not sure I see much difference between owning and renting when it comes to who gets the money.
Re: A house that costs $20k
#186Earlier quoted context omitted.
Prefab houses can be built in a single day. In fact in china they built a prefab skyscraper in 15 days.
Including plumbing, flooring, electricity, hooking up utilities etc. ? Please cite your sources because extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.
Re: A house that costs $20k
#187Earlier quoted context omitted.
It's extremely common in the US.
Huh, that doesn't make any sense to me. Smaller houses would make cities more walkable/livable and thus be better for people's health and the environment. Do people want those kinds of laws in order to protect their "investment"? I mean, I guess maybe your house will be worth more if all the other houses nearby are large and thus expensive? Of course, now in the digital age, I guess such laws seem sillier than they d…
I never understood suburbs - why not live in the country if you can't walk anywhere anyway?
Re: A house that costs $20k
#188Earlier quoted context omitted.
It's extremely common in the US.
Huh, that doesn't make any sense to me. Smaller houses would make cities more walkable/livable and thus be better for people's health and the environment. Do people want those kinds of laws in order to protect their "investment"? I mean, I guess maybe your house will be worth more if all the other houses nearby are large and thus expensive? Of course, now in the digital age, I guess such laws seem sillier than they d…
They don't want to be walkable, because then the financial threshold of car ownership is not a requirement for getting there.
Extend the idea of a playpen to older kids, and that is an American suburban subdivision. The inconvenience and unaffordability are features, not bugs.
Re: A house that costs $20k
#189Earlier quoted context omitted.
Like I said, I think we have a similar view. My objection if any, is based on the idea of a risk based portfolio. But it seems you actually mean more generally: savings. All these issues are of course very local. Being English I probably have a very different perspective on what the issues are regarding the affordability of houses, let alone what our specific views are. Primarily I see housing as a necessity rather t…
> Being English …. Primarily I see housing as a necessity rather than a financial opportunity. This is the opposite of what most English people seem to value, and vote in policies for. Is there any other country where property is treated so much as an investment? This[1] system is a good way to have reasonable rent, essentially a housing association. But housing associations in England are only for poor people; not t…
Though I disagree with you that most English people value and vote for the promotion of investment in housing. But then that could mean a million things; from stamp tax on buy to let mortgages, to freeing up green belts for development, to reforming housing benefit eligibility. It has always been and still is a massively divisive, sometimes violent and always complex issue in English society. Elections are won and lost on the nuances of these issues and politicians will often find a complex "3rd way" to attempt to appease everyone.
And that's without questioning your assertion that all English peoples values are dutifully represented by the political party currently holding majority in the house of commons. We also have a fairly unelected House of Lords having a final say in these matters - a notion that quite easily resonates with Serfdom.
Re: A house that costs $20k
#190Earlier quoted context omitted.
I'm Canadian, not American, but perhaps? I honestly (literally) don't understand what shocks you exactly. Save money -> invest money to grow savings -> time passes -> eventually you have enough to buy a home, if you want. I'm guessing you're saying that homes are so expensive, most people could not reasonably afford one even with disciplined saving and investing. But at least as a long term state, that seems logicall…
Like I said, I think we have a similar view. My objection if any, is based on the idea of a risk based portfolio. But it seems you actually mean more generally: savings. All these issues are of course very local. Being English I probably have a very different perspective on what the issues are regarding the affordability of houses, let alone what our specific views are. Primarily I see housing as a necessity rather t…
Just to address this, first, yes, I absolutely think people need to be able to buy a second house. There is also a natural impediment in place of investors buying up "too many" houses. The reason is, if there are more houses on the rental market than there is demand for rentals, it will drive rental rates down. Similarly, if there are not enough houses for sale to fill demand of all these investors as well as purchases for-self, it will drive house prices up. As those two things happen, the rate of return on an investment property will quickly become lower than that of other comparable investments, so people will not rationally keep buying investment properties until either prices go back down or more houses are built (which will also drive prices back down).
Obviously in the short term people don't always act rationally, but that situation can't logically persist indefinitely. (And while it does, renters get below-market rent, subsidized by owners. That was has been the case here in Canada for the past few years, and I happily rented for several of those years.) Long term though, investment owners will earn just enough return to make it worthwhile for them to provide the service of rental housing to people who want it. That's a good thing.
Now imagine if people couldn't buy second houses. It would be impossible to rent, because there would be no unoccupied homes. Yes, it would bring house prices down, but what if you were just starting out and didn't have the money to buy a home, even a cheap one? You would then have no options. I know you're not really advocating for outlawing second houses completely, but incentives for first-time buyers over investment buyers would have a similar effect to the lesser extent. You would be making first-time ownership cheaper, and renting more expensive.
Now, I don't think that some help for first time buyers is terrible policy. However, I think better policy would be to focus on helping young people in general. For instance, instead of a first time home buyers' credit, there could be a special reduced tax rate on the first $X (or £Y :P ) that a person earns after age 18. (Possibly varied on a means-tested basis.) That would help people get started, either saving up a down payment, or starting an investment portfolio, without skewing the housing and rental markets.
Of course I recognize that the problem with that plan is that many, or even most, people would waste that money instead of saving it. By tying it to house purchase, you force people to put it into an asset, and in turn, owning a home forces people to save (in the form of equity). However, we need to find a different solution to that problem, because we'll never be (or want to be) at the point where everyone is a home owner, and right now the people who most need that leg up early in life are the ones who aren't getting it. I don't know what the solution is, but there are certainly possibilities. For instance, a defined benefit state-backed pension plan can prevent people with no savings from being screwed in retirement. It could be made possible to borrow from one's state pension plan to buy a first home. In theory that should not skew prices vs rents as much as a straight tax break, because it's not free money. And it would be more equitable, because people who choose not to use it (or who aren't able to) will still get an equivalent benefit.