The Green Bay packers have an interesting approach to this problem, although it requires a fanatical fan base and special ownership provisions, and the fact that the team can't leave Green Bay (without a vote by the shareholders, who are all fans, which will never, ever, happen). When they want to improve their stadium, they issue stock and sell more season tickets. This works because Packers stock cannot be sold or…
Why a city should not build a stadium for an NFL team
271–280 of 290 posts
Re: Why a city should not build a stadium for an NFL team
#272Earlier quoted context omitted.
Football is very boring. I used to enjoy it, at least when the Steelers are playing. Then I got into soccer, eventually getting a more expensive cable package to watch the Premier League. Now when I watch football again, I am painfully aware of the time between plays, the incessant commercials, and now the ever increasing number of "official reviews". Seems like every 3rd or 4th play, an official has to leave the fie…
> Soccer, the action flows pretty constantly Yeah, but it's the same level of action in a single NFL play spread over an entire match.
There are constant one on one matchups of a dribbler trying to beat an attacker, or clever link up passes, or long balls contested by attackers and defenders, or, yes, shots on goal.
A fair number of NFL plays are just running up the middle for 1 or 2 yards gain.
So I really fail to see your point.
Re: Why a city should not build a stadium for an NFL team
#273Earlier quoted context omitted.
Football is very boring. I used to enjoy it, at least when the Steelers are playing. Then I got into soccer, eventually getting a more expensive cable package to watch the Premier League. Now when I watch football again, I am painfully aware of the time between plays, the incessant commercials, and now the ever increasing number of "official reviews". Seems like every 3rd or 4th play, an official has to leave the fie…
> Football is very boring. I agree! Why spend time on something that I have no effect on the outcome of? That's why I prefer gaming (especially online, against real other people). (Some people think online gaming is boring. But the fact that I do not understand how someone could possibly think that, is not an argument against their opinion.) > the action flows pretty constantly Ah, yes, those gripping 2 hour matchups…
(And I do love the organization and what it means to the city, just finding it harder to actually enjoy the games as much as I used to.)
Re: Why a city should not build a stadium for an NFL team
#274Earlier quoted context omitted.
Football is what usually happens between the three sets of the marching band concert. It keeps the crowd occupied, even if it is an inferior form of entertainment.~ I also never understood the appeal of professional football games, with no band playing there at all . It feels like the "spectacle" type of gladiatorial games--the re-enactments of the Battle of Wherever, with condemned criminals portraying the Foovians…
Marching bands are by far the worst aspect of college & hs football in my opinion, almost more annoying then the music/fake forced chants they play during NBA games. Some people just enjoy the sport without all the ridiculous fanfare!
Some people enjoy the game. Those who do not enjoy it should not be forced to pay for the stadium. I would even oppose using eminent domain to acquire a contiguous area of land large enough to build one, with the sole possible exception of Green Bay, Wisconsin, where the Packers are very nearly a municipal corporation due to their "ownership" structure (non-voting, non-dividend-paying, restricted-resale stocks don't count as ownership, in my opinion).
Selling the naming rights to the stadium to the highest bidder is just twisting the knife in the back, really.
This article is similar in character to economic retrospectives of cities that hosted Olympics competitions. The IOC always promises an instant boost to prosperity, but that never seems to materialize. I have been to Turner Field (formerly the primary 1996 Olympic stadium), and the surrounding area does not look very boosted (although other parts of Atlanta are admittedly much worse). The stadium is coming down in 2017, as a 20-year-old building is apparently no longer good enough for the Braves to play baseball in it. Their previous home at Atlanta-Fulton Cty Stadium only lasted 30 years.
For reference purposes, Fenway Park and Wrigley Field are both more than 100 years old and still in use. Stadiums in Kansas City, LA, and Anaheim are pentagenarians. Milwaukee County Stadium made it to 50 before the Brewers traded up. Yankee Stadium retired at 85. Tiger Stadium lasted 87 years. Candlestick Park retired at 53. Memorial Stadium (Baltimore, 2nd) lasted 53 years.
From a cursory examination of history, a city is much better off building its own smaller stadium, sized for basketball, hockey, and rock concerts, than one that can only reasonably be filled by MLB baseball, NFL football, Olympic track and field, club soccer (in Europe), and musical superstars. Offering public subsidy to a privately owned single-sport stadium strikes me as brain-damaged beyond all reasonable measure, especially when the sports franchise seeking to build it is currently leasing a publicly-owned facility.
Re: Why a city should not build a stadium for an NFL team
#275Earlier quoted context omitted.
Definitely football, it's more popular (unless you're in St. Louis). Baseball games are really fun to watch in person though, more so than football in my opinion. It's just an excuse to drink and shoot the shit while hearing a bat crack every once in a while, always a great night out Also checkout basketball, especially if you're in the bay.
That's why I hear some people say that Wrigley Field is Chicago's largest bar, and it happens to have a game field in the middle of it.
So, I couldn't imagine going just to have a few beers, in fact more likely to abstain on principle.
Re: Why a city should not build a stadium for an NFL team
#276Not just stadiums. This is why no city/state should be able to offer anything like this for any private entity, be they sports team, movie crew, or private company.
There is never a case when there is a net positive benefit for th city by enticing a corporation to move in?
Re: Why a city should not build a stadium for an NFL team
#277The Green Bay packers have an interesting approach to this problem, although it requires a fanatical fan base and special ownership provisions, and the fact that the team can't leave Green Bay (without a vote by the shareholders, who are all fans, which will never, ever, happen). When they want to improve their stadium, they issue stock and sell more season tickets. This works because Packers stock cannot be sold or…
Annnd that's a downvote. This community prides itself on good, honest discourse and high-level language. Please don't bring us down to the level of a 7-year-old redneck.
Re: Why a city should not build a stadium for an NFL team
#278Douchebags. Got it. HAHA - yet again, criticizing GS on HN results in downvotes. So now we have to worry about GS VC shills on HN as opposed to just eglin shills on reddit?
I have no idea what you are talking about and downvoted you for the drive-by stupidity, not because I (necessarily) disagree with you.
It is known that the cyber-ops team is based from there. There was a lot of astro-turfing going on, and in one of the wikileaks(?) post that came out - it was revealed that one of the founders of reddit was attempting to sell his services to the USG and others to show them how to drive/control/manipulate online sentiments (shilling).
There are a number of other cases about this online and in reddit in particular.
My comment was based on the fact that anything negative about GS appears to be immediately downvoted regardless of the veracity of the statement, if it even appears to be slightly negative.
My statement, then, is that I feel that GS is running/paying for a service to monitor any mentions of them and either (on social sites that allow votes) downvote these statements or, at times, post shill responses.
However, on a site like HN, any overly positive response to any denigrating response to GS would certainly be too transparent as astro-turfing, thus they simply downvote.
Re: Why a city should not build a stadium for an NFL team
#279The Green Bay packers have an interesting approach to this problem, although it requires a fanatical fan base and special ownership provisions, and the fact that the team can't leave Green Bay (without a vote by the shareholders, who are all fans, which will never, ever, happen). When they want to improve their stadium, they issue stock and sell more season tickets. This works because Packers stock cannot be sold or…
> could really care less Annnd that's a downvote. This community prides itself on good, honest discourse and high-level language. Please don't bring us down to the level of a 7-year-old redneck.
If you think a comment is bad for Hacker News, you're welcome to flag it, but not to post abusive noise.
Re: Why a city should not build a stadium for an NFL team
#280Earlier quoted context omitted.
It also has something more fundamental than religion... it is tribalism. Us versus them. You get to be part of the accepted in-group, and get to hate the out-groups. That kind of need is wired deep in people's brains. Ideally, all this effort would be put towards a more productive end, such as rooting for your local FIRST robotics team.
Have you ever heard of Dunbar's Number? http://www.cracked.com/article_14990_what-monkeysphere.html
Though, since we're all humans, you'd think we have enough common ground with each other anyway, what with death, taxes, relationship problems, etc.