No More Deceptive Download Buttons • Hacker News Board

Re: No More Deceptive Download Buttons

#171

Post by enzanki_ars » Thu, Feb 04, 2016, 6:39 PM UTC

alkonaut wrote: post #138

clinta wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This does not make any sense. Advertisers paying per view do not get charged for a view if crome prevents the user from viewing the page. The good news here is we now have official admission by google that allowing adsense ads without filtering is dangerous. And those of us who do not have sophisticated techniques that can detect deceptive ads have no choice to but to block the entire network serving them, if we want…

Any blockning of "malverts" should arguably just emulate view so it costs the advertiser even more than the lost view. If Google don't want to do that themselves (which would be understandable) they could likely expose it in APIs so plugins like ad blockers can do it.

Why not block it at the source instead? Prevent these types of ads from being submitted to AdSense in the first place.

Re: No More Deceptive Download Buttons

#172

Post by vlunkr » Thu, Feb 04, 2016, 6:41 PM UTC

kuschku wrote: post #165

dheera wrote: post #148

This "Google Safe Browsing" initiative seriously worries me. It's effectively some unknown, mysterious, un-contactable set of AI algorithms/people/who knows what controlling the internet because Google owns everyone's browser. One of my websites got tagged as "Dangerous" and having "harmful programs" despite having nothing of the sort. My guess is a silly hiccup of their neural network algorithms. And I have absolute…

> Google owns everyone's browser It doesn’t have to be like that.

It doesn't have to, but that's the way it's trending.

Re: No More Deceptive Download Buttons

#173

Post by ryanlol » Thu, Feb 04, 2016, 6:42 PM UTC

dheera wrote: post #157

ryanlol wrote: post #156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As with most things in this world, you could sue them.

It wasn't a major or revenue-generating site, so I don't want to spend on legal fees. If it had been though, I would.

Yeah, I've experienced the same and it's really a pain in the ass. Apparently there's tons of orgs that can automatically add sites to that blacklist, I got abuse from some company saying there was a phishing page on my IP because it featured a login page and the text "Amazon" and suddenly chrome started showing alerts when I visited the IP.

As with most of similar systems (spamhaus etc) the people running them are just as bad as the people they're trying to stop.

Re: No More Deceptive Download Buttons

#174

Post by jfoster » Thu, Feb 04, 2016, 6:43 PM UTC

kalkin wrote: post #115

onion2k wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Firstly, this will work on ad networks other than Google, so it''s more broad reaching than anything they could do just within AdSense. This is good. Secondly, and arguably more importantly, the way to stop these adverts is for them to cost the advertiser (in either money or time) without giving them the reward of revenue. If the ads stop working then people won't have a reason to make them. By stopping the ads in Ad…

"more broad reaching than anything they could do just within AdSense" ... as long as you don't care about browsers which don't run Google's Safe Browsing service. You know another way to stop these ads? Make available an advertising network which doesn't serve them. Website owners who don't want to install malware on their users' computers - which is probably most of us - would prefer that network to the others. As-i…

Surely it would make the most sense to build it into both AdSense and Chrome. That way Google know they're not running a network facilitating this, and they are also able to block malicious ads from other networks in the browser.

Re: No More Deceptive Download Buttons

#175

Post by crdoconnor » Thu, Feb 04, 2016, 6:46 PM UTC

ryanlol wrote: post #156

dheera wrote: post #148

This "Google Safe Browsing" initiative seriously worries me. It's effectively some unknown, mysterious, un-contactable set of AI algorithms/people/who knows what controlling the internet because Google owns everyone's browser. One of my websites got tagged as "Dangerous" and having "harmful programs" despite having nothing of the sort. My guess is a silly hiccup of their neural network algorithms. And I have absolute…

As with most things in this world, you could sue them.

They'd invoke the first amendment. It would be pretty open and shut.

Re: No More Deceptive Download Buttons

#176

Post by Osiris » Thu, Feb 04, 2016, 6:47 PM UTC

I hate using free hosted download services that some people use, especially on forums, because there are ads with download buttons and real download buttons and it's nearly impossible to tell which button needs to be clicked to initiate a download.

Re: No More Deceptive Download Buttons

#177

Post by nerfhammer » Thu, Feb 04, 2016, 6:49 PM UTC

crdoconnor wrote: post #175

ryanlol wrote: post #156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As with most things in this world, you could sue them.

They'd invoke the first amendment. It would be pretty open and shut.

If the claim that your site is dangerous is demonstrably false and there are demonstrable damages you can indeed be liable for damages or face injunction.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/False_statements_of_fact

Re: No More Deceptive Download Buttons

#178

Post by kbenson » Thu, Feb 04, 2016, 6:51 PM UTC

whyleyc wrote: post #9

This is a joke right ? We run Adsense display ads on our site and have to spend significant time every day reviewing and blocking new ads which try to use these deceptive practices. Since Google clearly has the tech to detect this they should be implementing it at source on the advertisers (malvertisers). Instead they are pushing this down to the publishers and hitting them with penalties. It's a clever ploy in some…

Well, it's a way for Google to throw their weight around to multiple effects.

First, it's positively perceived and accepted by end users, which is good for Google and end-users.

Second, it punishes ad networks that don't spend the time to vet what types of adds are allowed. As an end-user, I'm in favor of this.

Third, it boosts ad networks that do spend time vetting ads to prevent malicious ones. Presumably Google, and other networks, that spend time and resources doing this will see a return on that effort. This is good for responsible ad networks, and as an end-user, I'm in favor of this idea to the extent that it should hopefully reduce these malicious ads overall.

It's easy to see this as a way for Google to boost their own ad network, but I think that's too cynical of a take. They aren't boosting themselves specifically, they are punishing bad-actors and boosting good actors overall.

Re: No More Deceptive Download Buttons

#179

Post by tedmiston » Thu, Feb 04, 2016, 6:53 PM UTC

dheera wrote: post #148

This "Google Safe Browsing" initiative seriously worries me. It's effectively some unknown, mysterious, un-contactable set of AI algorithms/people/who knows what controlling the internet because Google owns everyone's browser. One of my websites got tagged as "Dangerous" and having "harmful programs" despite having nothing of the sort. My guess is a silly hiccup of their neural network algorithms. And I have absolute…

What website?

Re: No More Deceptive Download Buttons

#180

Post by bazillion » Thu, Feb 04, 2016, 6:54 PM UTC

kalkin wrote: post #115

onion2k wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Firstly, this will work on ad networks other than Google, so it''s more broad reaching than anything they could do just within AdSense. This is good. Secondly, and arguably more importantly, the way to stop these adverts is for them to cost the advertiser (in either money or time) without giving them the reward of revenue. If the ads stop working then people won't have a reason to make them. By stopping the ads in Ad…

"more broad reaching than anything they could do just within AdSense" ... as long as you don't care about browsers which don't run Google's Safe Browsing service. You know another way to stop these ads? Make available an advertising network which doesn't serve them. Website owners who don't want to install malware on their users' computers - which is probably most of us - would prefer that network to the others. As-i…

I've actually built an advertising network[1] that is not focused on serving display ads, but linking to content directly in images. Video demo: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8GfKBvs53Ss

The thought is that if "advertising" is actually a feature of a website, then it solves the problem of users trying to avoid being shown ads. If you could hover your mouse over an object on any image on the internet and be taken directly to where you can buy that without all the hassle, I'd see that as a big win.

Note: Just onboarded our first customer yesterday. He's using it to promote iPhone cases based on his instagram feed[2]. Hover over the cases on a desktop, and you'll see what the case is. Click on it, and it takes you directly to the product page.

[1] http://pleenq.com

[2] http://www.obeythekorean.net/pages/instagram-feed