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'Vegetative' patient speaks to scientists using his brainwaves

news.scotsman.com

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Re: 'Vegetative' patient speaks to scientists using his brainwaves

#11

Post by aaronblohowiak »

aarongough wrote: post #6

If that patient is actually aware of his surroundings, then he has been trapped in a body with almost no sensory input for almost 6 years. Personally, that sounds like the worst hell imaginable. I've told everyone close to me that if I am injured badly they are to ask for 'no extreme measures' for this exact reason...

The "trapped in a body" thing has a name and is well-researched: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Locked-in_syndrome

You should consider a living will if you are serious about avoiding this.

Re: 'Vegetative' patient speaks to scientists using his brainwaves

#12

Post by aaronblohowiak »

[deleted] wrote: post #10
aarongough wrote: post #6

If that patient is actually aware of his surroundings, then he has been trapped in a body with almost no sensory input for almost 6 years. Personally, that sounds like the worst hell imaginable. I've told everyone close to me that if I am injured badly they are to ask for 'no extreme measures' for this exact reason...

[deleted]

Brain-damaged people can be bored. You do not need to have total facilitates in order to avoid boredom.

Re: 'Vegetative' patient speaks to scientists using his brainwaves

#13

Post by tel »

aarongough wrote: post #6

If that patient is actually aware of his surroundings, then he has been trapped in a body with almost no sensory input for almost 6 years. Personally, that sounds like the worst hell imaginable. I've told everyone close to me that if I am injured badly they are to ask for 'no extreme measures' for this exact reason...

It's just the opposite actually, and worse. If he's aware of his surroundings, he's been trapped for 6 years without any output instead. Able to observe and think, but unable to move, unable to speak, unable to interact with or affect his environment except as a comatose patient.

Being Locked-in is one of the worst things I can imagine and yet is very real.

Re: 'Vegetative' patient speaks to scientists using his brainwaves

#15

Post by rms »

aarongough wrote: post #6

If that patient is actually aware of his surroundings, then he has been trapped in a body with almost no sensory input for almost 6 years. Personally, that sounds like the worst hell imaginable. I've told everyone close to me that if I am injured badly they are to ask for 'no extreme measures' for this exact reason...

I think within a few months you would descend into a self-hallucinatory dreamworld -- you'd be insane, but I don't think it would be the worst hell imaginable. Not even close.

Re: 'Vegetative' patient speaks to scientists using his brainwaves

#16

Post by aarongough »

aaronblohowiak wrote: post #11
aarongough wrote: post #6

If that patient is actually aware of his surroundings, then he has been trapped in a body with almost no sensory input for almost 6 years. Personally, that sounds like the worst hell imaginable. I've told everyone close to me that if I am injured badly they are to ask for 'no extreme measures' for this exact reason...

The "trapped in a body" thing has a name and is well-researched: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Locked-in_syndrome You should consider a living will if you are serious about avoiding this.

Good point on the living will... Up until now I have just made every person close to me promise to pull the plug if it ever came to a situation like this. I'll look into that some more...

Re: 'Vegetative' patient speaks to scientists using his brainwaves

#17

Post by mckilljoy »

This whole story is really very fascinating, although a few details seem a bit odd.

For example, the patient didn't answer the last question because.. he fell asleep? I would imagine if I was trapped inside my body and suddenly given a mechanism to communicate, I would be too excited to fall asleep.

Did they observe any signs of excitement that I would expect a person to feel in this situation? Increased heart rate or other brain activity? Did the man try to convey his own message using the new-found communication mechanism?

It almost sounds like they are communicating with some small ghost of the man's subconscious, something that can respond to basic queries and recall memories, but lacks what we would really consider a consciousness.

Re: 'Vegetative' patient speaks to scientists using his brainwaves

#18

Post by aarongough »

tel wrote: post #13
aarongough wrote: post #6

If that patient is actually aware of his surroundings, then he has been trapped in a body with almost no sensory input for almost 6 years. Personally, that sounds like the worst hell imaginable. I've told everyone close to me that if I am injured badly they are to ask for 'no extreme measures' for this exact reason...

It's just the opposite actually, and worse. If he's aware of his surroundings, he's been trapped for 6 years without any output instead. Able to observe and think, but unable to move, unable to speak, unable to interact with or affect his environment except as a comatose patient. Being Locked-in is one of the worst things I can imagine and yet is very real.

Yes, you are absolutely correct. I was kind of thinking in terms of interaction but got it backward.

What I was trying to convey was that no matter how dedicated your loved ones are they're not going to be with you every minute of every day if you're apparently comatose. That means this poor guy has probably spent most of the last six years lying in a bed by himself with nothing going on around him...

Re: 'Vegetative' patient speaks to scientists using his brainwaves

#19

Post by pohl »

mckilljoy wrote: post #17

This whole story is really very fascinating, although a few details seem a bit odd. For example, the patient didn't answer the last question because.. he fell asleep? I would imagine if I was trapped inside my body and suddenly given a mechanism to communicate, I would be too excited to fall asleep. Did they observe any signs of excitement that I would expect a person to feel in this situation? Increased heart rate o…

Did the man try to convey his own message using the new-found communication mechanism?

If I understand correctly, he was given the means to convey "yes" by imagining himself playing tennis. The concept of "no" was encoded by the absence of "yes".

If he had wanted to send some message, like "tell my children I love them", or "I feel pain in my abdomen", how would he encode it?

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