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Ask HN: Would you go to Iraq for a year and be paid $200k?

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Re: Ask HN: Would you go to Iraq for a year and be paid $200k?

#31
post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

my mind says yes, but my body says stay the fuck away, I dont wanna die. So the question still remains and I definitely am looking for advice.

Doesn't DC have one of the highest murder rates in the country? Whats to stop you from getting shot or into a bad car accident in Washington D.C.? Point is, theres always going to be a risk, regardless of where you happen to live. Might as well go somewhere interesting (and make a good bit of $ while you're at it, in this case).

I'm a DC native, born and raised. For starters, almost all that violence is between subsistence drug dealers in areas of the city and PG County where the poster is unlikely to even drive through. It doesn't involve the yuppies at all, and it's a fraction of what it was in the mid nineties before gentrification kicked into overdrive.

Furthermore, he said he was in "Washington DC area", which is code for the wealthy suburbs where the vast majority of the population lives. Most work there too: the only jobs in DC proper are in NGOs, lobbying, civil service, and the service jobs to support them.

Re: Ask HN: Would you go to Iraq for a year and be paid $200k?

#32
I'd do it if I wouldn't have a family here and realise: one year. what is one year? its about to be nothing and in the end maybe you like this country get contacts there and more opportunities for more jobs, projects, whatever. And about the risk. Scientists found out that the risk of dying on a heart attack increases about 50% if you are spending more than 5 hours per day in front of a computer or tv, so what are 3% compared to 50%? Offices equal all over the world.

One year for debt free living and extra money? Yes, you can.

edit: but please keep us informed and upload pictures :D

Re: Ask HN: Would you go to Iraq for a year and be paid $200k?

#33
If you are going to be coding, I would think that you are not going to be in too much danger - they aren't going to ship you out to places to install things in the thick of battle, right?

I say go for it. IIRC the entirety of the $200K will be tax free.

While there, network amongst the people there (you should be able to make some long term friends) and well, who knows where those contacts will lead afterwards.

Re: Ask HN: Would you go to Iraq for a year and be paid $200k?

#34
Money is a huge incentive especially early in your career. It will absolutely be a once in a life time experience, that said it may be your last experience in this lifetime.

You enjoy your job now and are only 4 months in. Do not discount the value of local experience relative to foreign experience. Later in your career taking experience abroad may be an asset depending on your role, but early on local experience and the local contact network you build has a lot of value.

I suspect the hour or two a day you spend relaxing can be filled with starting those projects you have "always wanted to get off the ground". It is far more dangerous there than it appears on TV; private contractor casualties are NOT public information. If it was elsewhere in the region like Dubai it'd be an entirely different equation, but it is Iraq.

This link will give you an impression of the lifestyle of a tech guy in Iraq http://www.rezendi.com/travels/bbbb.html "blood bullets ad bandwidth" be aware that the situation has changed since this was published and the danger is very real. If it seemed like you've been in that kind of environment before I wouldn't have responded at all as you'd know the score, but it sounds like you've never served in the military, or been in hot zones before, I urge you to consider carefully.

Re: Ask HN: Would you go to Iraq for a year and be paid $200k?

#36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

my mind says yes, but my body says stay the fuck away, I dont wanna die. So the question still remains and I definitely am looking for advice.

Where are you going? How safe is it? What type of insurance do you get. What would happen if in the worst case you lost your leg or arm? Do you have family to support/be away from. If your a single guy going to relatively safe spot I'd say go for it.

The US Government pays generous Worker's Compensation insurance premiums (mostly to AIG) for all overseas defense contractor employees under the terms of a WWII-era bill: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Defense_Base_Act

Re: Ask HN: Would you go to Iraq for a year and be paid $200k?

#37
I am a defense contractor; I've worked in Iraq, Afghanistan, Kuwait, etc. since about 2004.

1) $200k is pretty weak, even for today (it's gone downhill overall). If you can get a secret (basically, us citizen and not a felon), and have decent tech skills, you should be at $200-350k.

2) It's not tax free. The FIRST ~$85k is tax-exempt, which saves you about 18k. You then pay taxes at the normal 27-36% rates above that. My win s that I don't have an apartment back in the US, so my only expenses while here are car payment, storage, and server colo.

3) Big difference in quality of life throughout the country -- if you're on base at Balad or Victory it's basically like living in a small town in the US. If you're out in a Bn or smaller unit on an iraqi army base, or out in the city, it's a lot different. I've done a variety.

4) If you've never been in the military or had contact with it, I'd do it for a year just for the experience -- it's actually something I think everyone should do for a couple years.

The biggest downsides for me:

1) I gained about 20 pounds last year in Afghanistan living on Bagram, due to the shitty but high-calorie carb-laden food.

2) Generally, working for government is the anti-startup. You are specifically instructed not to take any initiative, everything is more concerned about process than results, etc. Actual combat is different, but there is no real combat in Iraq or Kuwait now, and in Afghanistan it is unlikely a contractor involved in direct combat support would be posting like this on hackernews. (If I could get a job where I got to put bullets into bad guys 12-24h/day, I'd do it for $20k/yr, but aside from joining a government agency or the military, it would be difficult to find a contractor in 2010 who does this ... blackwater/triple canopy/etc. etc back in 2003-2005 were about the only ones)

3) There is no firm end date. I did this for 6 months just to see what it would be like, and have wasted about 4 of the past 5 years in the sandbox. I'm planning to leave in a few months to work on a startup of my own in the USA again (maybe YC 2010 Summer!), using some of my experiences from here, but it's totally possible to keep doing this indefinitely.

4) The war is definitely winding down, so pay, upward mobility, etc. continue to decrease

5) People in the defense industry are NOT like startup people -- there are huge amounts of fraud, backstabbing, incompetence, etc. Startup deals for $50m can be done on a handshake; here you need lawyers, contracts, audits, etc. or you will get fucked.

Re: Ask HN: Would you go to Iraq for a year and be paid $200k?

#38
post #34

Money is a huge incentive especially early in your career. It will absolutely be a once in a life time experience, that said it may be your last experience in this lifetime. You enjoy your job now and are only 4 months in. Do not discount the value of local experience relative to foreign experience. Later in your career taking experience abroad may be an asset depending on your role, but early on local experience and…

Heh, that article was written about me by my friend Jon!

It's not really very realistic for 2010 working for a big contractor, in 2005 things were in flux and I ran my own tiny company.

Re: Ask HN: Would you go to Iraq for a year and be paid $200k?

#39
Also, people here do not realize:

An IT contractor (presumably for ITT, at that low salary) is working at a helpdesk on a big base. The contact with locals is almost zero. You'll encounter a lot of interesting third country nationals (filipinos, indians, etc.) working on base, but that's about it. Mainly, you will be dealing with other Americans (military or contractor.

It's basically the most boring helpdesk job possible in a boring environment.

The "contact with local culture" is "local vendor sets up a shop on base selling overpriced carpets and camel figurines".

If you just want contact with an exotic culture, go backpacking in India/Nepal/Indonesia/etc.

The only reason for defense contracting in 2010 is money, and "seeing what the military is like up close" (I thought it was much more homogenous and omnipotent than it turned out to be. I'm not sure if I like it more or less now)

Re: Ask HN: Would you go to Iraq for a year and be paid $200k?

#40
If it were me, I would not go. I would love to be paid $200k, but it's not a life changing amount of money worth the risk I see associated with going there. (if it were $500k+, it starts getting a bit different)

If you want to do it for the experience, that's one thing, though there are many places in the world that are fairly safe without bearing the same risk at the moment, and I'm sure spending one year in a completely different culture will be a life-changing experience!

But if you want to do it for the money, this isn't a significant amount of money in the long term.

But, of course, that's just my opinion. :)

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