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Jonathan Blow's new game, The Witness, is out

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Re: Jonathan Blow's new game, The Witness, is out

#181

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I do not mind new panels introducing concepts; what I mind is the symbols not always being clearly connected with the mechanic they introduce. For example, the black and white symbols that needed to be separated were intuitive.

MINOR SPOILER/HINT BELOW While I sort of agree, I must say that part of the fun of the game (and much of the challenge) is learning the 'language' of each puzzle. In the case of the little orange suns, it was like learning from scratch, one letter at a time. First panel: "Okay, I can't go between them." Second panel: "Oh, I can, but have to end up on one side... which amounts to having them in the same section. How i…

Spoiler Alert?

Re: Jonathan Blow's new game, The Witness, is out

#182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the default sorting for Steam reviews is by how helpful a review was. Looking through some of the positive and negative reviews, it seems like the positive reviews are fairly short and don't say much about the game, while the negative reviews are longer and the reviewers do mention what they thought did and didn't work about the game, so the longer reviews that have a negative opinion end up being the most he…

The proportion of votes for negative vs positive reviews seem way off. I wouldn't be surprised if there was some vote brigading going on for whatever reason. Either that or people mindlessly vote for the longest review.

Seriously. I posted a short review about how I liked the game (with some minor reservations) and immediately got, like, 3 downvotes.

Gamers these days are children.

Re: Jonathan Blow's new game, The Witness, is out

#183

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, it's a puzzle game. So I might argue that not being intuitive is kind of the point. And to that point, maybe one reason I've found so many recent major game titles boring recently is that there is no puzzle to them. They're just activities. Go here. Shoot that. Collect that. It's nice to actually be stumped. And not just frustrated by my lack of hand-eye coordination.

Hmm, a non-intuitive puzzle isn't really a puzzle anymore, is it? Q: I have three oranges and one grapefruit. I have to get all of them through a door that's been glued shut. There is no way to open the door. How do I get the fruit through? A: Blend them and use the tube lying next to the door and pour them through the keyhole. That's a non-intuitive puzzle. You can't intuit that there's a keyhole, a tube and a blend…

That's not how the puzzles in The Witness work. At least not in my experience with the game so far.

Re: Jonathan Blow's new game, The Witness, is out

#185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

MINOR SPOILER/HINT BELOW While I sort of agree, I must say that part of the fun of the game (and much of the challenge) is learning the 'language' of each puzzle. In the case of the little orange suns, it was like learning from scratch, one letter at a time. First panel: "Okay, I can't go between them." Second panel: "Oh, I can, but have to end up on one side... which amounts to having them in the same section. How i…

Spoiler Alert?

True, I should have mentioned that and have added. Pretty much everything is spoilery in threads about the game, though. What I described is fairly early and basic, though, not some big revelation. Go try the game if you haven't!

Re: Jonathan Blow's new game, The Witness, is out

#186
Wow, back in the day I loved Atlantis the lost tales [0], this definitely has that feel. I would have bought it already if I had more than just Linux at my disposal...

With the Steambox/machine now in production I thought the divide windows/Linux was shrinking rapidly. I'm not at all a gamer though.

[0] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JYlzsZcuVkY

Re: Jonathan Blow's new game, The Witness, is out

#187

Wow, back in the day I loved Atlantis the lost tales [0], this definitely has that feel. I would have bought it already if I had more than just Linux at my disposal... With the Steambox/machine now in production I thought the divide windows/Linux was shrinking rapidly. I'm not at all a gamer though. [0] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JYlzsZcuVkY

Any consoles? It's on PS4 too, and while I haven't checked I'd guess it's on Xbox One.

Re: Jonathan Blow's new game, The Witness, is out

#188
There’s been a lot of coverage about the puzzles and ingenuity of the gameplay, but equal attention should be given to the amazing artistic style of the game.

a couple of blog posts about the making of the trees: http://the-witness.net/news/2013/06/2157/ http://the-witness.net/news/2011/06/witness-trees/

I’d love to see more videogames step away from uncanny-valley and ill-advised attempts at photorealism and instead embrace unique artistic style.

Re: Jonathan Blow's new game, The Witness, is out

#189

There’s been a lot of coverage about the puzzles and ingenuity of the gameplay, but equal attention should be given to the amazing artistic style of the game. a couple of blog posts about the making of the trees: http://the-witness.net/news/2013/06/2157/ http://the-witness.net/news/2011/06/witness-trees/ I’d love to see more videogames step away from uncanny-valley and ill-advised attempts at photorealism and instead…

That's been really big for Oculus games from what I can tell. It has the added benefit of being faster to render, allowing for a GTX970 (the minimum spec card for oculus) to be able to drive games at the required speed. Lucky's Tale[1] is a good example of this.

[1] http://playfulcorp.com/

Re: Jonathan Blow's new game, The Witness, is out

#190
(SPOILERS, obviously. Mostly surface-level.)

I absolutely love the game, but for the sake of discussion, I have to admit that I'm slightly disappointed by the puzzle-paneliness of it all. I didn't read many spoilers over the 8 years of its development, but Jonathan Blow always made a point to emphasize the epiphany-based nature of the game. I took this to mean that as you gain knowledge from the panels, you slowly begin to understand how to use them to engage in more interesting ways with the world. Instead, the opposite is true: the world simply provides different kinds of masks to solve the puzzles with. In other words, the panels are still the beating heart of the game, while the world is mostly static.

To me, this goes against what I like most in games. I find that one of the primary advantages of this interactive medium is the ability to solve puzzles by intuition. Braid was particularly good at this: instead of having to stand in front of a challenge and reason it out in your mind, you could dive right in and play around with the mechanics until your mind took on the solution all on its own. Over time, you acquired a feeling of natural mastery over these new elements. The Witness does not feel like this; more often than not, you have to logic out the puzzles in your head or on paper, and it never feels as good as using the game world to interactively solve a problem.

(Yes, I'm aware of the obelisk puzzles, but it seems they still follow more or less the same formula. But I haven't gotten very far in that direction, so we'll see.)

The game also makes me think about the problem of hidden knowledge in open-world games. Most metroidvania-style games gate the player with keys or abilities, but a few are starting to add paths that are closed solely based on the player's knowledge. One of the first games I remember doing this is Super Metroid: the wall jump and high jump allowed you to get to a lot more places, but they were nearly impossible to discover without the bird helpers. Fez did this with its Tetris language. La-Mulana did it with its obscure inscriptions. And The Witness does it with the ruleset of its various puzzles -- more completely than any other game before it. Still, I wonder if there's a better way to stash away that kind of knowledge. The puzzle panels are a bit too abstract for my tastes. I'd love to see a game where the hidden knowledge you find is entirely ability-based, but not obscure like in Super Metroid.

Again, The Witness is a masterpiece and one of the few games I'd gladly call art. It would be worth $40 just for the opportunity walk around the incredibly beautiful world. Just some food for game design thought! :)

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