ADHD Is Fuel for Adventure • Hacker News Board

Re: ADHD Is Fuel for Adventure

#41

Post by ap22213 » Thu, Jan 28, 2016, 3:02 PM UTC

derefr wrote: post #34

ap22213 wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not to discount your experiences, but that's not at all how I've felt as a sufferer of ADHD (nor my parents or my son). I would describe the feeling of ADHD not as lack of motivation but severe, almost physical, discomfort at attempts to concentrate. If you've ever suffered from nerve pain, you may know what I'm talking about. It's not quite analogous, since the ADHD discomfort is more of a strong, distracting 'itch'…

Your and my descriptions feel so qualitatively different that I've got to wonder if fundamentally different things are going on between the two. A previous HN thread had a lot of people comparing ADHD to the effect of chronic sleep debt, with the suggestion that ADHD could be an effect of the inability to enter deep sleep. "Like never having slept enough" isn't an analogy I would make for my symptoms, but it would se…

I don't know, maybe. The members of my family have the hyperactivity part of it, too. But, the hyperactivity is like constantly staying moving (while learning) to avoid that discomfort. And, I totally understand the distraction part and the need to feel overstimulated. Now that I'm thinking about it more - it's like I have to work extremely hard to remove my attention from the rest of the environment. Almost like I'm taking in too much information, and it's hard to shut out the other stuff. Does that make sense?

But, that's an interesting perspective, because all of the members of my family have some sort of bipolar, as well. And, bipolar has co-morbidity with ADHD. So, maybe that type of ADHD is different?

As far as NRIs, yeah I once had a panic attack (also co-morbid with bipolar and ADHD) and had to go to the ER. The neurologist gave me an NRI, and it made me so absolutely sick - it was a feeling like someone twisting my brain inside out.

Also, I've had sleep studies done, and I've had no underlying sleep issues.

Re: ADHD Is Fuel for Adventure

#42

Post by greys0ul » Thu, Jan 28, 2016, 3:02 PM UTC

falcolas wrote: post #33

greys0ul wrote: post #4

I think this is an excellent way to help some kids cope with adhd, but I definitely don't think it'd work universally. Reading this made me think back on my own struggle with adhd. A few years ago I was diagnosed with adhd at the age of 23, and god damn do I wish it happened a decade sooner, but my parents were the type that didn't believe in that kind of stuff, so I was just lazy. It's stuck with me to this day even…

> but my parents were the type that didn't believe in that kind of stuff, so I was just lazy. You're not the only one: I failed many high school courses because I couldn't focus on getting the homework done. Official Parental diagnosis: Lazy $*#@. And my mother was even trained to identify mental problems like this, but developed a blindness to my symptoms.

I barely skated through highschool pretty much on test scores alone. If I couldn't do the homework in class the day it was due, it basically didn't get done. My sat scores managed to get me into college, which I dropped out of due to the homework. Went to two more community colleges after that for a year each, then another college I got a scholarship at but only made it 2 years there before I got a good job (thank god for my interest in computers from age 6) and decided it wasn't worth it. I'm considering going back now that I've gotten my head straight though.

Re: ADHD Is Fuel for Adventure

#43

Post by sathackr » Thu, Jan 28, 2016, 3:04 PM UTC

SpaceCadetJones wrote: post #20

tokenadult wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Would my kid have any problem living in a simpler society (hunter-gatherer group) ? Definitively not. I know some children like that. Children who cannot keep quiet while hunting would not fare well in a hunter-gatherer society. Indeed, young members of a hunting party who move around too much and make too much noise are in danger of being eaten themselves by larger predator animals. I'm not sure that there has ever…

The thing with ADHD is that the difficulty to maintain attention is often highly situational. As someone diagnosed I personally have a lot of trouble focusing on a lot, but when it comes to something like juggling or playing counter-strike it's pretty remarkable how well I suddenly tune everything out and get extremely engaged. Probably more so than a "neurotypical" person and their preferred activities. I'm also gen…

Yep. Get me in front of KSP(or World of Warcraft in the past) and 14 hours will have passed without me even looking up.

My older sister hates fidgeting. She punches me(somewhat playfully, on the arm/leg/etc...) every time I start 'bouncing'. I generally wind up with a few bruises when we have lunch. My leg will unconsciously bounce, or I'll start tapping, she'll give me a warning, I'll stop. Then in 30 seconds unconsciously start again. WHAP!. I might remember for a minute this time. Rinse repeat.

Re: ADHD Is Fuel for Adventure

#44

Post by sathackr » Thu, Jan 28, 2016, 3:10 PM UTC

greys0ul wrote: post #42

falcolas wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> but my parents were the type that didn't believe in that kind of stuff, so I was just lazy. You're not the only one: I failed many high school courses because I couldn't focus on getting the homework done. Official Parental diagnosis: Lazy $*#@. And my mother was even trained to identify mental problems like this, but developed a blindness to my symptoms.

I barely skated through highschool pretty much on test scores alone. If I couldn't do the homework in class the day it was due, it basically didn't get done. My sat scores managed to get me into college, which I dropped out of due to the homework. Went to two more community colleges after that for a year each, then another college I got a scholarship at but only made it 2 years there before I got a good job (thank go…

Interesting nearly simul-post. Same here, I scored 1250 on the SAT, 31 on the ACT, and in the top 99th percentile on the CPT.

Literature/Comprehension has always been my weakness "Read the passage below, then select what you think best describes the point the author is trying to make" -- they all look like right answers.

Took 18 credit-hours per semester of courses on scholarship, right out of high school, failed all of them miserably, dropped out, goofed off for 5 years doing whatever would make money. Got a good job that pushed me back to school, once again got a scholarship, went for another year or two, was forced to quit due to personal circumstances. I have two years left on my BS in Computer Engineering, I may finish one day, but it's not very important to my current line of work.

Re: ADHD Is Fuel for Adventure

#45

Post by rtpg » Thu, Jan 28, 2016, 3:14 PM UTC

fasteo wrote: post #18

Slightly off-topic, but I have seem some great responses here I would like to add a somehow controversial comment. I have a 10 year old kid diagnosed with severe ADHD-Inattentive type. He is on meds and behavioral therapy, and I must agree with most of the posts that meds is a must for these kids. My very personal an unscientific explanation is that ADHD is not a disease in the traditional sense; instead, it is just…

There's a lot of research about ADHD, more than many other mental diseases...

There are a couple of things to remember:

  - ADHD is a deficit in executive function, and one of the main symptoms is impulsive behaviour (unable to control urges). This is what causes hyperactivity, but also causes things like angry outburts, and other improper social behaviour that follows into adulthood

  - The concensus among the research community is that ADHD is all negative. Measurably negative among all axes, especially when comparing people when on treatment and when not on it (drugs).

 I know some people like to do the whole "silver lining" thing (like with autism), but ADHD is a disease, an impairment. You should think of it like you would think of having the flu your entire life. Sure, you get good at vomiting your guts out cleanly, but not much great about it.

  - And a super important part is that this basically never goes away. There's this great analogy with a paraplegic. If you had a prosthetic leg, no matter how long you walked with it, you could never "train yourself" out of needing a prosthetic leg. Same thing with ADHD. The impulsive feelings don't leave, it's just that adults tend to be better at dealing with it than kids. But treatment is still very useful even later.


 (That last part is important: emotional outbursts at work can be a bit hard to manage...)

Re: ADHD Is Fuel for Adventure

#46

Post by greys0ul » Thu, Jan 28, 2016, 3:16 PM UTC

fdanconia wrote: post #32

greys0ul wrote: post #4

I think this is an excellent way to help some kids cope with adhd, but I definitely don't think it'd work universally. Reading this made me think back on my own struggle with adhd. A few years ago I was diagnosed with adhd at the age of 23, and god damn do I wish it happened a decade sooner, but my parents were the type that didn't believe in that kind of stuff, so I was just lazy. It's stuck with me to this day even…

What are your coping methods?

My main one is a notebook that never leaves my side. If I have a thought, impulse or idea that isn't what I'm currently doing, I quickly write it down, usually with a flowchart kinda sketch and then go back to what I was doing. I give myself a maximum of about 15 seconds for this. Once I finish what I was originally doing I look in the notebook and pick the next thing to do.

The other big one is 3 goals a day. Every morning when I wake up, I give myself 3 goals that I must accomplish before going to bed. Generally they're trivial things, take out the trash, wipe down the kitchen counter, that kind of thing. I find that no matter how simple, it gives me the feeling of accomplishing something I set out to do and helps me reinforce non-impulsive thinking/decision making and remind myself that I can in fact finish a task that I thought of more than 30 seconds ago.

I can expand on how I cope tonight when I have more time if you'd like.

Re: ADHD Is Fuel for Adventure

#47

Post by greys0ul » Thu, Jan 28, 2016, 3:17 PM UTC

krampus wrote: post #26

greys0ul wrote: post #4

I think this is an excellent way to help some kids cope with adhd, but I definitely don't think it'd work universally. Reading this made me think back on my own struggle with adhd. A few years ago I was diagnosed with adhd at the age of 23, and god damn do I wish it happened a decade sooner, but my parents were the type that didn't believe in that kind of stuff, so I was just lazy. It's stuck with me to this day even…

Which no-medication methods do you use ?

I wrote a little above on them: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10988605

I can expand later today when I have a bit more time.

Re: ADHD Is Fuel for Adventure

#48

Post by falcolas » Thu, Jan 28, 2016, 3:18 PM UTC

greys0ul wrote: post #42

falcolas wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> but my parents were the type that didn't believe in that kind of stuff, so I was just lazy. You're not the only one: I failed many high school courses because I couldn't focus on getting the homework done. Official Parental diagnosis: Lazy $*#@. And my mother was even trained to identify mental problems like this, but developed a blindness to my symptoms.

I barely skated through highschool pretty much on test scores alone. If I couldn't do the homework in class the day it was due, it basically didn't get done. My sat scores managed to get me into college, which I dropped out of due to the homework. Went to two more community colleges after that for a year each, then another college I got a scholarship at but only made it 2 years there before I got a good job (thank go…

Sadly, I had a few teachers who had a "must complete all homework to take the test" rule which pretty much screwed me over.

It was entertaining, however, to fail the Calculus high school class, and get a perfect score on the AP exam. Of course, that did nothing but reenforce the "Lazy *&#@" label to my parent's eyes.

Re: ADHD Is Fuel for Adventure

#49

Post by cylinder » Thu, Jan 28, 2016, 3:21 PM UTC

derefr wrote: post #2

Orthogonal. Having ADHD doesn't imply a desire to be outside playing. It's a disorder of motivation, not a disorder of focus—an inability to practice , and sometimes to concentrate ; but not an inability to think, or to enjoy thinking. Personally, in my childhood, I liked math and science. I had (and still have) ADHD, which made that hard, but I struggled through, because that was my passion. Medication (which I didn…

You nailed it, this is me. When I have new stimuli I'm fully engaged to the point my head hurts at the end of the day from focusing so much. But then, the stimuli wear away and I'm back searching for new stimuli rather than powering through my work.

I don't know what to do.

Re: ADHD Is Fuel for Adventure

#50

Post by antihero » Thu, Jan 28, 2016, 3:24 PM UTC

spacedmountain wrote: post #5

derefr wrote: post #2

Orthogonal. Having ADHD doesn't imply a desire to be outside playing. It's a disorder of motivation, not a disorder of focus—an inability to practice , and sometimes to concentrate ; but not an inability to think, or to enjoy thinking. Personally, in my childhood, I liked math and science. I had (and still have) ADHD, which made that hard, but I struggled through, because that was my passion. Medication (which I didn…

I would further polish your desription - and call it a disorder of mismatched motivation. People with ADHD can motivate just fine on things that stimulate them - and have even reported 'hyperfocus', a trance-like state of emersion in something. The problem is things that are not stimulating become very challanging or even impossible. This is why bills, appointment, rules, and chores can be so difficult for ADHD peopl…

Oh man, speaking to the choir. When I'm coding something interesting, my motivation and ability to focus is second to none. When it comes to things that don't massively interest me my brain is completely unable to focus. I've got better.

It's like our brains are like a magnetic pole. Some stuff is a opposite pole (so our brains magnetise towards it), and some are like the same pole and your mind is repelled from the task.

Once I was walking into the kitchen to pick something up off of the counter, and then as I reached for it, I got distracted and reached for the the fridge, and ended up literally falling over because I was trying to go in two different directions.