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Hire Literally Anyone

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51–60 of 78 posts

Re: Hire Literally Anyone

#51
So here's an idea for a program:

An apprentice goes to a coding bootcamp, paid for by an company with a $2,500/month stipend. Then, the apprentice would work for the company for $2,500/month for one year, or otherwise the coding bootcamp tuition must be repaid.

This would work out to a cost of about $55,000 for a year of labor.

That would be significantly cheaper than hiring a coding bootcamp grad, and removes the economic risk from the apprentice. What if the market were to soften? What if they ended up being one of the graduates that could not land a job?

This offloads a lot of training to the bootcamp, which have job training as their core competency. Other commenters have pointed out flaws with the system proposed by the author.

In addition, it generally aligns incentives so that the apprentice is less likely to leave right after the initial training. As part of the deal, the coding bootcamp would help the apprentice with finding some other job, since they have already committed to an employer. If they did renege on that part of the deal, the employer only lost out on $7,500. And once the apprentice proves their worth (in the event that they do), the employer could offer a market salary that would start after the apprenticeship, along with a signing bonus of about $20,000 or so. The apprentice would probably want that signing bonus immediately, and sign that offer unless the candidate disliked the company.

If anyone wants to kickstart this concept, I think this would make a great nonprofit. Figuring how to implement such a program would be a distraction for the company, especially if they just wanted to dip their toes in the water with one apprentice at first. The nonprofit would get $10,000 per apprentice, and additional donations by companies could lead to higher priority in selecting potential apprentices.

Re: Hire Literally Anyone

#52
post #23

It's a great idea but the reason why this won't work is because after you have invested time to train them from nothing, they will leave for another company. There is plenty of precedent for this, during the dotcom days and in India the last 10 years.

I'm reminded of the cliche posts I see on LinkedIn about this. What happens if we invest in our people and they leave? What if we don't, and they stay?

Just to argue the point since I see this often too: If they stay... fire them? Or let them keep working at a consistent baseline?

Re: Hire Literally Anyone

#54
post #45

Wow, what a crock of shit. How did this get to the top of HN? - It seems the author has some problem with technical people but they never state what the problem is. - The author identifies that technical people aren't strong on "Problem solving, teamwork, self-teaching, communication, attention to detail, organization, etc." What the shit? These are exactly what makes technical people so strong. Maybe the author does…

It's classic, this person clearly does not understand shit about engineering, so they move the goal posts. "Oh its all the non engineering personality factors that are actually important... not like uh, what you can actually build... teamwork!"

The rest of this reads like "all these nerds should share their NERDMAGICK so us normal people can do IMPORTANT THINGS"

Re: Hire Literally Anyone

#55
post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure, that's why every college relies on them for admissions, not to mention everyone taking the GRE / MCAT for grad school. Are applied sciences grad programs not "creative work" in your mind? Standardized tests statistically predict success within those programs. http://portal.scienceintheclassroom.org/sites/default/files/...

More and more colleges are NOT using them for admissions because they predict NOTHING.

Where's your source? The parent's source is about 8 years old but still completely valid.

Re: Hire Literally Anyone

#56
post #7

Teaching people to develop software is hard. It requires commitment. In the framework author is describing if those people want to succeed they will not be able to do it part time while doing non-technical work for you. Also rubber ducking with the actual developer takes a lot of developer's time (and it's hard) - so the organization will take a big productivity hit if developers work half time as programming teacher…

To be perfectly honest, teaching people to build software is a lot, lot easier than other engineering disciplines.

Re: Hire Literally Anyone

#58
post #25

That's fine, you do that, but I do not want to be an engineer at your company. I already have a junior engineer I'm working with and it's hard enough spending hours a week making sure their PRs get fixed, every PR has 20 to 40 comments in it. With someone who doesn't even know how to code? Forget it.

PR?

Re: Hire Literally Anyone

#59

It's a great idea but the reason why this won't work is because after you have invested time to train them from nothing, they will leave for another company. There is plenty of precedent for this, during the dotcom days and in India the last 10 years.

It doesn't have to be that bad. There's an old bit about the teacher learning more than the students.

I've known plenty of master programmers who could tell me nothing about mastery other than 'train hard, train long'. I think actually this comes from 'sacrificing' everything else in life to become good coders at a young age, and we don't take the time to see what mastering other skills looks and feels like. I call it "Master of one, master of none."

Every time you teach something you should get a little better at teaching it. Your materials should get clearer. Your understanding of the material should improve. At the end of the day you and your training material are better for having had the student, even if they bail on you just when they're getting interesting. But if you respect the student and the exercise I don't think you'll have that happen that often, unless there's something fishy going on elsewhere in the organization.

Conversely, I think going off and earnestly learning a martial art, cooking ('mise en place' is a concept every coder should know), an instrument, or Chess or Go, or preferably at least two of those, will do wonders not just for your coding but for your personality. First, you will have to get comfortable with being bad at something again. Then you will watch yourself think you have something figured out, and then the teacher will tear it all down and build you back up at a new layer, only to tear it all down again a year from now. Watching that rug get pulled out from underneath you over and over again makes you start wondering what other things in life you're comfortably dead wrong about, because you believed in a colorful fiction that was 'true' for you where you were but is not the objective truth. And maybe the objective truth doesn't matter because it benefits almost nobody anyway. There's just where you are and where you're going.

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