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ChakraCore GitHub repository is now open

blogs.windows.com

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Re: ChakraCore GitHub repository is now open

#171

Post by dilijev »

mwcampbell wrote: post #162
bobajeff wrote: post #3

Here's hoping EdgeHTML will also get open sourced. I know they've talked about it internally.

Considering how deeply Windows-specific EdgeHTML is likely to be, I don't think open-sourcing it would be very useful, unless someone wants to backport it to Windows 7 and 8.1. I'd rather Microsoft allowed developers to embed EdgeHTML in Win32 desktop applications running on Windows 10.

Hi. Chakra developer here. I don't speak for the Edge team, but there is a blog out that indicates it is already possible to embed EdgeHTML via the WebView control in Universal Platform apps: https://blogs.windows.com/msedgedev/2015/08/27/creating-your...

I know that doesn't entirely address your wish, but it's a step in the right direction. :P

Re: ChakraCore GitHub repository is now open

#172

Post by _greim_ »

bastawhiz wrote: post #80

To everyone chanting "Embrace, Extend, Extinguish", I'd like to remind you that Node proper was a golden egg sitting under Joyent's goose. When Joyent decided they didn't want to embrace anymore, the community took the extinguisher out of their hands. Granted, Microsoft is in a more similar position to Google than to Joyent, but the point of the argument is that the community has driven the language and the runtime f…

> putting it all up under MIT. There's little you can do to get more open and honest than that.

I disagree. Node was OSS-licensed under GitHub back in the Joyent days, but the inner circle was still very much closed. PRs languished for months or even years. The leap from there to here for Node is, arguably, bigger than the leap from closed-source to open. Evidence: io.js had to happen.

Re: ChakraCore GitHub repository is now open

#173

Post by abrookewood »

balls187 wrote: post #147

I'm skeptical. Over the past 5 years or so, Microsoft has lost developers as a core group. There are certainly interesting things happening out of their dev group, but with the rise of Cloud infrastructure, cheap (free) alternatives to WINS stacks rose tremendously in popularity. I was a Seattle Techstars 2013 Founder, and the only two teams using MSFT tech were those whose founders were ex-Microsoft employees. This…

In both cases the fault was in your own company and you are trying to use that to distinguish between two suppliers. There's no guarantee that Amazon will continue to be so lenient in the future (though you aren't the first person to mention them acting like this). For what it's worth, I think the new direction for MS is a good thing. They're far from my favourite company, but I dislike them less the more they release software as open source.

Re: ChakraCore GitHub repository is now open

#174

Post by mintplant »

Artemis2 wrote: post #62
Klathmon wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Having more than one engine can mean that there is less of a V8 monoculture. Bugs in V8 don't become "standard" and "things that V8 is really good at" doesn't become "things that Javascript is really good at".

That's what Go does. The reference of the language is [an actual document]( https://golang.org/ref/spec ), not a reference implementation. There are two compilers (gc and gccgo), and this way, no edge-case of an implementation can make its way into programmers' habits, something that tends to happen a lot with JavaScript.

Is this another [1] standard language feature that's being chalked up to Go now? Everything old is new again.

[1] The first being statically-linked binaries.

Re: ChakraCore GitHub repository is now open

#175

Post by krisdol »

bastawhiz wrote: post #80

To everyone chanting "Embrace, Extend, Extinguish", I'd like to remind you that Node proper was a golden egg sitting under Joyent's goose. When Joyent decided they didn't want to embrace anymore, the community took the extinguisher out of their hands. Granted, Microsoft is in a more similar position to Google than to Joyent, but the point of the argument is that the community has driven the language and the runtime f…

>When Joyent decided they didn't want to embrace anymore, the community took the extinguisher out of their hands

Joyent wound up embracing io.js, and Node.js is moving at a very fast pace now while maintaining LTS branches in parallel. It's a very well managed project, in my opinion.

Aside, how come anything remotely questioning of Microsoft when there's an announcement is met with downvotes?

Re: ChakraCore GitHub repository is now open

#176

Post by DoubleMalt »

Someone1234 wrote: post #146
sqeaky wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even if microsoft told, that doesn't mean we should automatically trust it. The could be wrong or lying. I would prefer source code, but someone will eventually do packet captures to figure at least some of it out.

Go ahead and provide evidence that they're wrong or lying. People have been drum beating this privacy stuff for over six months now. But they seem to lack specific evidence, so now I invite you to present it.

It would be easy to dispel the accusations by open sourcing windows [/troll]

Re: ChakraCore GitHub repository is now open

#177

Post by ksp4186 »

morebetterer wrote: post #149
ksp4186 wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Microsoft is already working on lighting Node.js with ChakraCore. See https://github.com/Microsoft/node

Ironically Microsoft had to create a V8 C++ API facade over Chakra in order for Node to compile with it. https://github.com/Microsoft/node/tree/chnext/deps/chakrashi... It's interesting that the license of the Chakra shim is the V8 license: https://github.com/Microsoft/node/blob/chnext/deps/chakrashi...

That's correct. V8 license is required in v8-*.h files because they are v8 header files that chakra shim uses. The implementation files has Microsoft license.

E.g. All files in https://github.com/Microsoft/node/tree/chnext/deps/chakrashi...

Disclaimer: I work for Chakra team (powering node.js)

Re: ChakraCore GitHub repository is now open

#178

Post by [deleted] »

mintplant wrote: post #174
Artemis2 wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's what Go does. The reference of the language is [an actual document]( https://golang.org/ref/spec ), not a reference implementation. There are two compilers (gc and gccgo), and this way, no edge-case of an implementation can make its way into programmers' habits, something that tends to happen a lot with JavaScript.

Is this another [1] standard language feature that's being chalked up to Go now? Everything old is new again. [1] The first being statically-linked binaries.

[deleted]

Re: ChakraCore GitHub repository is now open

#179

Post by mraleph »

dsp1234 wrote: post #137
swang wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What do you mean by the, "edge-case of an implementation... makes its way into programmers' habits" as something that happens a lot in javascript. Maybe I'm not understanding but I read that statement and I don't see how that applies to javascript.

Since node.js is backed by V8, optimization decisions that the V8 team have made end up in developer code that runs in node.js. For example, Bluebird has a list of "optimization killers"[0] that many developers that I know use as a reference when making node.js libraries. However, these optimizations are V8 only, and so "edge-case of an implementation makes its way into programmers' habits". A quick example is "5.1.…

> optimization decisions that the V8 team have made

Optimization decisions that V8 team have made are much more universal than it might seem.

It is true there are sometimes strange artificial corner cases - but those are often either bugs or temporary solutions that are going to be replaced with something more generic as soon as they start to hurt too much code.

> which ends up with having to jump through some hoops in a for-in loop

Could you clarify which hoops precisely do you need to jump through?

I am not sure I can imagine a reasonable chunk of code that strives to be both fast, well written and wants to use a context captured or global for-in variable.

    for (IWantThisVariableToEndUpOnGlobalObject in obj) { }
How often do you write code like this?

Re: ChakraCore GitHub repository is now open

#180

Post by krisdol »

carussell wrote: post #124
comex wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

However, since ChakraCore is released under a permissive license (like most corporate open source projects), Microsoft could do the same thing without a CLA. It matters more when something is under a GPL variant...

It's a good point, but it matters for Apache licensed code, too, because Apache 2.0 has a self-destruct clause in the patent grant to keep all parties' lawyers in check. CLAs (like the one Microsoft uses) routes around that. The way this ends up working for Microsoft projects licensed under Apache 2.0 is that it essentially allows Microsoft to do anything with the contributions (as if it were licensed under MIT, with…

>I'm totally confused about why people are having a problem with this comment.

It seems like half of this submission is a graveyard. Disappointing.

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