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ChakraCore GitHub repository is now open

blogs.windows.com

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Re: ChakraCore GitHub repository is now open

#131

Post by ksk »

Someone1234 wrote: post #97
jrcii wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> MS really changed its approach to software Their open-source friendliness has unfortunately coincided with a decline of their respect for user privacy and choice (Windows 10). I find the "New Microsoft" bittersweet.

The Windows 10 privacy thing is completely overblown. Most of the privacy settings that people are most worried about is tied into Cortana or more specifically what you allow Cortana to do on your behalf. You can simply choose not to use Cortana or to disable it entirely. Google Now & Siri support the same functionality but ironically don't give you the settings to disable it, so nobody bats an eyelid. Beyond that yo…

It is not overblown. I'm very happy that Microsoft is getting bad press. Hopefully this drives people away from Windows. This is the only way Microsoft "listens". When their revenue takes a hit. The primary issue with Windows 10 is how Microsoft is forcing people to upgrade to it. The secondary issue is with the lack of controls given to users.

I don't want certain Win 7 machines that I own/maintain to ever upgrade to Windows 10. Didn't ask for it. Don't want it. Just go away and let me do my job. Microsoft provides me no official way to disable that horrendous popup. I expect that shit from shady browser toolbars, and bundled crapware, not Microsoft.

Microsoft seems to think the users can't be trusted with options to disable Updates, Telemetry, and other BS services. I absolutely HATE having to ever reboot my windows machine. It is extremely critical for me to have my dev box be rock stable and running 24/7. I frequently used to go months without ever rebooting it. Also, with Win 7 I could just set the Update behavior to "don't call us, we'll call you". With Windows 10 I'm forced to muck around with services and group policy just to get my machine to update and reboot on my schedule, rather than Microsoft's.

As a customer of MS, I despise these methods, as I continue to use their OS, because there simply isn't any other alternative. All I can hope for is people who don't specifically need Windows to switch to other OSs en masse. At this point I could be swayed into thinking that its a good idea to support anti-microsoft efforts even if they are not based in facts (as you point out, nobody has shown exactly what they collect), just to obtain the result that you want.

Re: ChakraCore GitHub repository is now open

#132

Post by ascagnel_ »

frigg wrote: post #88
jrcii wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> MS really changed its approach to software Their open-source friendliness has unfortunately coincided with a decline of their respect for user privacy and choice (Windows 10). I find the "New Microsoft" bittersweet.

>Their open-source friendliness has unfortunately coincided with a decline of their respect for user privacy and choice (Windows 10). As far as I know they give you the option to opt out of everything. Are they bad even for asking?

They do, but the options aren't reasonable (like the automatic sharing of Wifi AP passwords unless you change the AP's SSID).

Re: ChakraCore GitHub repository is now open

#133

Post by Sanddancer »

JupiterMoon wrote: post #49
jhchen wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's wrong with a CLA? It's incredibly common for projects open sourced by companies.

It means that the company owns the copyright to everything and can close the source again any time they want. EDIT Dear mods. Some pretty measured posts are getting serious heat in this (and other threads relating to MS) maybe you could look into it?

The FSF has requires contributors to sign one too. Are they evil as well?

Re: ChakraCore GitHub repository is now open

#134

Post by sqeaky »

magicalist wrote: post #115
Someone1234 wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Windows 10 privacy thing is completely overblown. Most of the privacy settings that people are most worried about is tied into Cortana or more specifically what you allow Cortana to do on your behalf. You can simply choose not to use Cortana or to disable it entirely. Google Now & Siri support the same functionality but ironically don't give you the settings to disable it, so nobody bats an eyelid. Beyond that yo…

> Most of the privacy settings that people are most worried about is tied into Cortana or more specifically what you allow Cortana to do on your behalf In all of these discussions on HN, the only ones bringing up "worries" about Cortana features have been people defending Windows 10 (and now Windows 8 and 7) data collection. It's easy to disable and, if you choose not to use it, it won't collect data anyways. The sam…

Even if microsoft told, that doesn't mean we should automatically trust it. The could be wrong or lying.

I would prefer source code, but someone will eventually do packet captures to figure at least some of it out.

Re: ChakraCore GitHub repository is now open

#135

Post by JupiterMoon »

Sanddancer wrote: post #133
JupiterMoon wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It means that the company owns the copyright to everything and can close the source again any time they want. EDIT Dear mods. Some pretty measured posts are getting serious heat in this (and other threads relating to MS) maybe you could look into it?

The FSF has requires contributors to sign one too. Are they evil as well?

They require a CLA for exactly the same reason. So that they can change the licence later on if they want.

However, the FSF has a different record to Microsoft over the last 40 years wrt FOSS software.

Re: ChakraCore GitHub repository is now open

#136

Post by sqeaky »

smt88 wrote: post #108
jfoutz wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not saying i agree, but we consider history for every decision made. Want to loan someone money? consider their credit rating. Want to hire someone? consider their employment record. Microsoft has a long history of not being so nice when they have an advantage. How much of that is leadership driven, and how much is built into the corporate culture and structure? It's knee-jerk, but it's not crazy to think about.

> Want to loan someone money? consider their credit rating. Want to hire someone? consider their employment record. That's a single person. Microsoft is many thousands of people, and the most important decision makers have changed. In your analogy, you're considering whether to loan money to an almost completely different person.

Those same decision frequently had hiring and promotion authority. How different are these new people? Are they someone the old decision makers promoted minutes before leaving or are they fresh new hires? Chances are there is a complex mix and at least some of microsoft's behavior has changed and some will remain the same.

Re: ChakraCore GitHub repository is now open

#137

Post by dsp1234 »

swang wrote: post #120
Artemis2 wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's what Go does. The reference of the language is [an actual document]( https://golang.org/ref/spec ), not a reference implementation. There are two compilers (gc and gccgo), and this way, no edge-case of an implementation can make its way into programmers' habits, something that tends to happen a lot with JavaScript.

What do you mean by the, "edge-case of an implementation... makes its way into programmers' habits" as something that happens a lot in javascript. Maybe I'm not understanding but I read that statement and I don't see how that applies to javascript.

Since node.js is backed by V8, optimization decisions that the V8 team have made end up in developer code that runs in node.js. For example, Bluebird has a list of "optimization killers"[0] that many developers that I know use as a reference when making node.js libraries. However, these optimizations are V8 only, and so "edge-case of an implementation makes its way into programmers' habits". A quick example is "5.1. The key is not a local variable:", which ends up with having to jump through some hoops in a for-in loop, not because it's easy or because the language forces it, but just because V8 is the engine.

[0] - https://github.com/petkaantonov/bluebird/wiki/Optimization-k...

Re: ChakraCore GitHub repository is now open

#138

Post by jsingleton »

vmorgulis wrote: post #67

> ChakraCore > The MIT License (MIT) > Copyright (c) Microsoft Corporation Incredible! https://github.com/Microsoft/ChakraCore/blob/master/LICENSE....

Great stuff. I've worked professionally in the .NET development ecosystem for almost a decade and I've never been so enthusiastic about the direction that Microsoft is taking. Their embracing of open source practices is very positive and will help to retain and maybe even attract developers. You just don't have to worry about licensing any more this way. You can actually sit an MCP exam in MS product licensing, it's that complicated.

This announcement is probably timed to coincide with NDC. There were lots of similar open source announcements at a previous MS conference I was at. Although it was a bit weird due to the time difference on the embargo.

Re: ChakraCore GitHub repository is now open

#139

Post by plesner »

Caveat emptor. The license only gives you permission to use the code, not any patents covering it. So while you can read the code, to use it you need to either get a separate patent license or convince yourself that MS holds no patents on the code. I'm not going to do a patent search, nor do I want to know, but I would be surprised if they haven't patented aggressively.
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