Voxel Quest January 2016 Update • Hacker News Board

Re: Voxel Quest January 2016 Update

#91

Post by chipsy » Wed, Jan 13, 2016, 3:46 AM UTC

gavanwoolery wrote: post #45

munificent wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Many many many game developers get sucked into the infinite vortex of trying to "find the fun". A computer is a very large blank canvas and the set of all possible games is infinite. It can be overwhelming trying to decide what game to make. Often, developers wander off to "make an engine" partially as an excuse to put off making those scary decisions. But an engine isn't a game and if you want to ship something peop…

Thanks Bob! Totally agree with you - it really is a battle of fighting against my "engineering instinct" which just wants to build stuff all day, no matter how useless it is. I have deliberated over this internally with myself and others for a long time. In fact, half way into the character animation I was kicking myself for even beginning working on it. I tend to justify things (whether rational or not) as a content…

As someone who has commented on your engine threads in the past(and pointed out this challenge) it's good to see that you're getting towards the content stage of dev.

Here is my tip this time: try to find a lot of anchors outside of the game engine. You can do design incrementally by defining what the "rules", "logic", and "lore" of the world are, in order to clarify it. For example, use a mind map tool like a writer to plan scenario ideas. Pick a genre of music and a visual design language and incorporate them into the game's identity. Consider the limitations of the camera and control scheme and allow those elements to shape the scenarios. Borrow plots and characters from stories you like. Compose an essay response to something you want to critique, and then figure out ways to turn that essay into game form. If you don't have ideas for game mechanics, you can develop the story more instead and you'll eventually find some story elements that convert into mechanics.

The more of these things you can piece together in a coherent way, the more it will start to look like a complete design where "the work is cut out for you", instead of being a mass of bad content to crank out. There are a lot of ways to go about defining the design, but you will have to find some anchors if you want good content without a lot of meandering and second-guessing. The meandering should happen in notes and sketches, well before you try to write final code or assets.

Oh, and all of this can be done with an eye towards marketing. You can opt to choose and highlight elements specifically to capture an audience. The hard part tends to be finding concepts that you're happy enough with to want to think about for months on end.

Re: Voxel Quest January 2016 Update

#92

Post by emilioolivares » Wed, Jan 13, 2016, 4:14 AM UTC

The success of Minecraft comes from the ability to create. If you can capture that magic into Voxelquest I can see this being huge. I would love a game where I could create my terrain, set-up my army (like I would my toys) and then let them fight and be able to record and share the videos of the action. Wish you the best!

Re: Voxel Quest January 2016 Update

#93

Post by rasz_pl » Wed, Jan 13, 2016, 4:40 AM UTC

sergiotapia wrote: post #9

For the uninitiated why is this exciting? The graphics look really washed out and jittery. Thanks!

especially when you compare it to something like this https://www.youtube.com/user/AtomontageEngine/videos

Re: Voxel Quest January 2016 Update

#94

Post by gavanwoolery » Wed, Jan 13, 2016, 5:37 AM UTC

chipsy wrote: post #91

gavanwoolery wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks Bob! Totally agree with you - it really is a battle of fighting against my "engineering instinct" which just wants to build stuff all day, no matter how useless it is. I have deliberated over this internally with myself and others for a long time. In fact, half way into the character animation I was kicking myself for even beginning working on it. I tend to justify things (whether rational or not) as a content…

As someone who has commented on your engine threads in the past(and pointed out this challenge) it's good to see that you're getting towards the content stage of dev. Here is my tip this time: try to find a lot of anchors outside of the game engine. You can do design incrementally by defining what the "rules", "logic", and "lore" of the world are, in order to clarify it. For example, use a mind map tool like a writer…

I agree - ironically I am not particularly interested in a fantasy setting and many other people are tired of fantasy as well (although I could still probably get away with such a setting). Fortunately if I do decide to do some other design there is not really much work towards content yet - all of the stuff in there is broadly applicable. I have always been interested in a Fallout-style universe. As much as those things are important (and they are) above all I think I really need to laser in concept-wise as well; that may just mean mean going with something tried and true in the early stage.

Re: Voxel Quest January 2016 Update

#95

Post by gavanwoolery » Wed, Jan 13, 2016, 5:42 AM UTC

munificent wrote: post #55

gavanwoolery wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks Bob! Totally agree with you - it really is a battle of fighting against my "engineering instinct" which just wants to build stuff all day, no matter how useless it is. I have deliberated over this internally with myself and others for a long time. In fact, half way into the character animation I was kicking myself for even beginning working on it. I tend to justify things (whether rational or not) as a content…

> I tend to justify things (whether rational or not) as a content problem ("Oh I can just build this system and it will make making this type of content so much easier!"). That can also be a trap (one that I myself am particularly prone to given how much I love roguelikes and tool-building). When it comes to games, I'm just not wired right to enjoy hand-authoring content. So when I do game-like stuff, I tend to lean…

I agree, especially if you are just making one game, there really is no point to procedural generation - other tools will make all that much easier (Maya, Blender, etc). I'm trying to think outside the context of just making one game, but rather making something that people can broadly use that it is simpler than Maya and Blender, and even disguised as a game to lure people to it. This could be a foolish move - the odds are already against me making a game, let alone a platform/engine. But I feel like somebody has to shake things up a bit, we are getting too comfortable with our AAA Unreal games. :)

Re: Voxel Quest January 2016 Update

#96

Post by jsilence » Wed, Jan 13, 2016, 5:48 AM UTC

I find the achievement and persistence of Gaven absolutely astounding. You have my utmost respect and I wish you good luck and success with the project. I always love to see the updates on progress. If there were a game to buy I'd just buy it as a hat tip to show the respect.

Re: Voxel Quest January 2016 Update

#97

Post by gavanwoolery » Wed, Jan 13, 2016, 5:57 AM UTC

WhiteNoiz3 wrote: post #89

gavanwoolery wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks Bob! Totally agree with you - it really is a battle of fighting against my "engineering instinct" which just wants to build stuff all day, no matter how useless it is. I have deliberated over this internally with myself and others for a long time. In fact, half way into the character animation I was kicking myself for even beginning working on it. I tend to justify things (whether rational or not) as a content…

I also struggle with adding extra features to a game I'm working on. I've added "You're not going to need it" to the top of my to-do list as a way to force myself to think everytime I add something on there. ;) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/You_aren%27t_gonna_need_it Have you ever heard of the game Magic Carpet? See http://www.gog.com/game/magic_carpet . It had insanely good destructible terrain, base building and ex…

Yep I know about Magic Carpet - its one of those games (along with Outcast, Commanche, etc) that drew me to alternative engines over polygon-based ones. Initial ideas for a prototype did revolve around base building, mini RTS / tower defense style stuff.

Re: Voxel Quest January 2016 Update

#98

Post by gavanwoolery » Wed, Jan 13, 2016, 5:58 AM UTC

TeMPOraL wrote: post #74

gavanwoolery wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The major difference is that Starbound made heaps of money (not to mention that Terraria sold 7 million + units!) I'm still looking for change under the couch. :)

Oh come on, that's just... not right, given the amount of work and time you put into it. I don't see any "Donate" button on your page, so I just bought the pre-order. Don't lose it all under the couch ;).

Thanks for your support! :)

Re: Voxel Quest January 2016 Update

#99

Post by gavanwoolery » Wed, Jan 13, 2016, 6:01 AM UTC

anonova wrote: post #81

BatFastard wrote: post #10

Wow, I was high sceptical that you would be able to scale this up past the short view distance. But not only have you managed to get a good view distance, but you also added in a nice animation system. Congrats to you! This is coming from someone who has spent years designing their own voxel platform. Please get this out to users to let them start building things, you will be amazed at what they can create.

NovaLogic's Delta Force (1998) and Delta Force 2 (1999) had a "voxel game engine [that allowed for a] nearly unlimited draw distance" [1]. Though the other objects in the game were rendered with polygons, has a far view distance been difficult with modern voxel engines? [1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Delta_Force_2#Game_engine

Delta Force and Commanche were among games that drew me to alternative engines. Doing a CPU-based renderer gives you lots of new tricks and abilities, things you can't do with simplified massively parallel architecture like GPUs. Many games have a far view distance now (see Uncharted or Just Cause) - but doing it in a dynamic world that is procedurally generated in realtime with solid geometry is a whole other bag of cats. :)

Re: Voxel Quest January 2016 Update

#100

Post by gavanwoolery » Wed, Jan 13, 2016, 6:04 AM UTC

skybrian wrote: post #88

gavanwoolery wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interesting. Welp, looks like I'm going to have to resort to adding sex to the game. :) But seriously, the idea of a "direction" for difficulty had only vaguely occurred in my mind (for whatever reason, I am drawn to games where you ascend or descend to progress, most notably Spelunky).

I'd be interested in seeing a voxel game involving defensive architecture (preparing for disasters). When I started playing Minecraft, I was interested in making buildings, lighted streets, etc that would make it easier to survive at night. It turned out to be somewhat pointless because once you know how, you can easily skip the night phase altogether. A game where you can't do that might be interesting. Also: prepar…

Yep, a survival type game would be well suited to the engine. It is definitely part of the long term plans. In the long run I would like to have a world with some simple towns and people can move about and raid towns and so forth and quests kind of emerge from those circumstances. Maybe a bit like Mount and Blade, but in a more seamless world.