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The Surreal Story of StubHub Screwing Over a Kobe Fan

theleadsports.com

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Re: The Surreal Story of StubHub Screwing Over a Kobe Fan

#131

Post by mikeash »

URSpider94 wrote: post #129
mikeash wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

With eBay the seller also has to deliver in a timely fashion. You're right, if they fail then the best that happens is you get your money back, but you find out reasonably quickly whether or not they're going to perform, and there's never any confusion about whether or not the transaction has completed. So a big part of this problem is that StubHub is letting sellers cheat buyers out of massive appreciation by not gi…

As others have mentioned, in many cases the seller doesn't physically have the tickets at the time of sale, and might only get them a few days before the game. Ticketmaster cooperates with venues to do this to -- dum dum dum -- avoid ticket resale. That's the problem.

If they're going to support such tickets then they need some big "seriously, deliver what you sold" penalties for bad sellers.

Re: The Surreal Story of StubHub Screwing Over a Kobe Fan

#132

Post by kin »

AlexC04 wrote: post #104
kin wrote: post #92

He's getting 4 free ticket from Budweiser in section 112 and 4 free tickets in section 106 personally delivered by the CEO of Tickets For Less. Now, Stubhub has apologized and promised to get him to the game. If I were him I'd deny the Stubhub tickets regardless of how good they are. Budweiser tickets are middle bottom level section (great view) while Tickets for Less are offering behind the backboard seats. Both are…

I've found this one in the comments: > Jason Durbin · VP of Ticket Operations at Tickets For Less > Jesse Sandler – I’m the VP of Ticket Operations at > Tickets For Less. We’ve reached out to > TheLeadSports.com and are trying to contact you. > We have four seats for you in section 106 for Kobe’s > last home game. Please contact me or our President Dan > Rouen at 913-685-3322. > Like · Reply · 1228 · 23 hrs But where…

https://twitter.com/Budweiser/status/684878816959856640

Re: The Surreal Story of StubHub Screwing Over a Kobe Fan

#133

Post by DrScump »

People need to realize that buying from Stubhub guarantees you only this: if your order isn't filled (or is filled with bogus tickets) and we can't find you tickets we consider equivalent or better at some point (even during the game, then you'll get a refund). The only thing "guaranteed" is your payment. (You might also get additional credit toward a future purchase.) People need to be aware of this when buying major-event tickets: they are happy to "walk" you (give you no ticket alternatives at all) if it's at all costly to cover a bogus sale. I've seen it a number of times at their pickup sites.

So, for example, if this happens at a Super Bowl, you are still out all of your transportation, lodging, and other expenses.

Re: The Surreal Story of StubHub Screwing Over a Kobe Fan

#134

Post by DrScump »

mikeash wrote: post #9
hotgoldminer wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

SH has no mechanism to ensure delivery of the ticket. The seller holds the ticket, so how can SH compel them to hand it over - short of not releasing the buyer's payment to the seller. Short being the operative word. SH is running a speculative marketplace against n% insurance fee on unfulfilled sales.

Why are they set up this way? The purchase should confer ownership at the time of purchase, or within a reasonable time afterwards, in such a way that it is physically impossible for the seller to take back ownership without the cooperation of the buyer.

Stubhub can charge a violating seller.

Or, try to. Stubhub actually has a huge fraud exposure. The seller is paid within days of the buyer receiving the tickets, even if the event is much later.

If the tickets were counterfeit in the first place, or invalidated later, Stubhub can only hope that the credit card the seller signed up with is still valid... or ever was. Meanwhile, the buyer gets a refund (eventually) or a substitute (if prices have dropped).

Re: The Surreal Story of StubHub Screwing Over a Kobe Fan

#135

Post by DrScump »

mikeash wrote: post #77
kedean wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because someone needs to hold them in escrow, otherwise it's a 'he said she said' argument. How would SH know whether or not the seller actually withheld the tickets, if they've never seen proof that the tickets even exist? That or they just assume the buyer is always right and take a hit.

You're right, for paper tickets there needs to be a trusted third party that handles them. There's no need to send the tickets in advance, but once the sale occurs, you'd really have to send them through StubHub or another third party. I see no reason StubHub couldn't do this, of course. They could even spin it as a feature: the seller never learns your address and your privacy is protected! For electronic tickets, w…

  You're right, for paper tickets there needs to
  be a trusted  third party that handles them
Stubhub does no such thing. For physical tickets, seller ships to buyer. For PDF tickets, seller just uploads them; the upload constitutes delivery.

For events that Stubhub lacks hooks into the ticketing system (mostly baseball), they do nothing to vet tickets. Buyers are advised to create a listing in TicketExchange (or whomever is the official marketplace) to (1) validate the tickets and (2) lock them to prevent forwarding or TicketExchange sale by a prior holder.

Re: The Surreal Story of StubHub Screwing Over a Kobe Fan

#136

Post by DrScump »

FireBeyond wrote: post #100
mikeash wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure, "some period" is fine. When you buy stuff on eBay, for example, your product might not even ship for a couple of days. In this case, though, it was a month later and they still hadn't been delivered. That's no longer reasonable. It's possible the ticket issuers won't issue tickets even in that timeframe. StubHub's web site has warnings that the tickets might not be available until 72 hours before the event. In…

For Lakers games and season ticket holders, TicketMaster doesn't 'e-print' the ticket until 96 hours before tip off, to try to minimize ticket resale (which it doesn't, or only marginally, because they're counting on people not being able to keep track of that - which StubHub helpfully does).

The 49ers did that this season (72 hours)... one of many ways they pissed off the season ticket base.

Re: The Surreal Story of StubHub Screwing Over a Kobe Fan

#137

Post by DrScump »

karzeem wrote: post #86
hotgoldminer wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

SH has no mechanism to ensure delivery of the ticket. The seller holds the ticket, so how can SH compel them to hand it over - short of not releasing the buyer's payment to the seller. Short being the operative word. SH is running a speculative marketplace against n% insurance fee on unfulfilled sales.

They could charge sellers the greater of the purchase price or the market price of the ticket at the time of cancellation.

... assuming that the seller didn't abscond with the payment and cancel the credit card used to guarantee the transaction long ago.

Re: The Surreal Story of StubHub Screwing Over a Kobe Fan

#138

Post by DrScump »

mathgeek wrote: post #18
hotgoldminer wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

SH has no mechanism to ensure delivery of the ticket. The seller holds the ticket, so how can SH compel them to hand it over - short of not releasing the buyer's payment to the seller. Short being the operative word. SH is running a speculative marketplace against n% insurance fee on unfulfilled sales.

> SH has no mechanism to ensure delivery of the ticket. StubHub fully supports digital tickets that are immediately delivered upon purchase. They should, IMHO, require this when it's available.

In fact, most Stubhub tickets are electronic ONLY after about 3 business days before the event. But they do nothing to validate the PDFs (not even to check for unaltered PDFs)

Re: The Surreal Story of StubHub Screwing Over a Kobe Fan

#139

Post by DrScump »

mikeash wrote: post #111
Dylan16807 wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They did not follow through on actually protecting the fans, just restoring the original money. They are presenting the appearance that they will ensure the purchase, while the terms actually promise no such thing.

Yeah, the "Fan Protect Guarantee" is more like "Fan Protect Guarantee Unless The Price Goes Up A Lot."

This.

The old Stubhub (pre-eBay) made a BIG deal of denied-at-door situations, and local managers had broad discretion to source replacement tickets, even at higher cost.

Nowadays, they realize that doing so is not profitable in the short term.

Re: The Surreal Story of StubHub Screwing Over a Kobe Fan

#140

Post by DrScump »

diogenescynic wrote: post #106
hotgoldminer wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

SH has no mechanism to ensure delivery of the ticket. The seller holds the ticket, so how can SH compel them to hand it over - short of not releasing the buyer's payment to the seller. Short being the operative word. SH is running a speculative marketplace against n% insurance fee on unfulfilled sales.

>SH has no mechanism to ensure delivery of the ticket...so how can SH compel them to hand it over Sure they do, just don't release funds until the tracking number shows the tickets have been delivered or the PDF has been uploaded.

They do that, now.

But having a ticket doesn't mean that it will be valid at the gate... or was ever valid.

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