How much equity would you be getting? I wouldn't consider it for less than a double digit percentage.
Double digit, nothing confirmed yet though.
Ask HN: Should I accept a CTO position without much experience?
21–30 of 61 posts
Re: Ask HN: Should I accept a CTO position without much experience?
#22Earlier quoted context omitted.
2, maybe 3. At least for the first months.
So you are not getting paid, but they are? Are you getting some substantial equity?
They would get paid as soon as I start getting paid. Another reason to do our best to get funded fast.
Yeah, good equity, nothing confirmed yet though.
Re: Ask HN: Should I accept a CTO position without much experience?
#23I apologize if the following comes off as harsh, but it comes from experience, not malice.
Where can I find people like you who will work for free on the promise of future money dependent on a roll of the die which is funding? Please tell me. I'll take one CTO, 2 senior devs, and 4 junior devs.
Here's the deal. I don't know your situation, but you are basically saying that your time is worth $0. That might be true or it might not be. You have to be the one to decide that.
Additionally, if the company gets funded, the very first thing that will happen is you will be fired or otherwise relieved of your position and they will hire an experienced CTO who will be paid a lot of money. This is the smart money move for them and a pat on the back for a job well done is all you will be likely to get. By that time, you will have no solid programming experience, having played spreadsheet warrior for a year or two, and being at least one level abstracted away from the real work through which you would earn your bread once you leave this losing lottery ticket.
Finally, you have no experience. You might not even conceive of what this role requires. You are being asked to be a CTO during an internship. This is a glorious chance to fail. How strong are you emotionally, to face a humiliating failure? Your decisions will be picked apart and your current lack of experience will be laid bare for everyone to witness.
Re: Ask HN: Should I accept a CTO position without much experience?
#24I wasn't in the exact same boat as you, but I did take a CTO role without much experience under my belt. I'm actually only a year older than you.
And yeah, we failed, like most startups do, and I had to quickly scuttle to find another source of income. That sucked. Truth be told, I'm still paying off a lot of debts I made from trying to survive sans-salary.
But I have no regrets whatsoever about what I did. It didn't make me a better programmer, but it did make me better at helping employees out, it made me better at understanding productivity, and it gave me an overall better perspective on how to build great products.
And don't worry about engineers being smarter than you. Doesn't matter, that's the ideal anyway. The important thing is to be the one who listens and makes things better for the engineers so they have what they need to build a great product.
The salary part sucks, yeah. I basically had to moonlight when I was working as a CTO. This is where I would really advise you put some serious thought as to whether or not you would really be committed to this startup, because in all likelihood you'll wind up with a full-time-plus job as an underpaid executive, and you'll have to moonlight on the side in order to make up for the remainder of the unpaid bills. You won't have a whole lot of time for side-projects, if any at all. Not for a while anyway.
But seriously, don't worry about failure. As long as you listen you should be okay. Even if you're not, you'll still learn something, and it'll be really valuable for the next phase of your life. Case in point: I'm building my own startup now, and I have more confidence going into it because of the lessons I learned.
Oh, and one more final takeaway. You'll have to do some fighting. Your job as CTO of is to lead the technical element of the company, but fellow executives, or your boss, may occasionally step on your toes. Sometimes they're right, sometimes they're wrong. When they're wrong, stand up for yourself, be diplomatic about it, but don't be a pushover about it, and back up your case with some evidence. You'll win some and lose some, just try not to lose too many crucial battles.
Re: Ask HN: Should I accept a CTO position without much experience?
#25How much equity would you be getting? I wouldn't consider it for less than a double digit percentage.
This is a pet peeve of mine. You're likely taking a greater risk than your "boss" here is. You should be asking and getting at least 30% if you're going into an unfunded, unproven, un-DEVELOPED company. I start negotiations at 50% in these situations and make a potential partner defend a reduction from that point.
But the top two comments in this thread nailed it. This is not going to end well for you in all likelihood. I'd pass on it.
Re: Ask HN: Should I accept a CTO position without much experience?
#261. I am not a lawyer but my understanding is: In the US, it would be illegal to pay less than the minimum wage. Many but not all jurisdictions have similar laws.
2. The idea of hiring people smarter is sound and will server you and employers well. Employers are people who actually pay.
3. If funding is as far away as May, the company is underfunded and has difficulty raising capital since it needs capital to pay your salary now. Or maybe the boss plans on replacing an inexperienced CTO with an experienced one once funding is in place...my friend Greg once got hired with no professional experience as the chef for a restaurant a month before it opened. I went to the grand opening party on a Thursday night. Friday there was a new experienced chef and Greg was out of a job. Clearly, none of that was spur of the moment.
4. If the title on your resume seems more valuable than knowledge skills abilities and money, then strongly consider the offer.
Good luck.
Re: Ask HN: Should I accept a CTO position without much experience?
#27While you may be young, you're smart. You already noticed that there's an issue with your lack of experience. The question is: How do you solve that issue? Your success as CTO is mostly determined by yourself. Understand what's required of you. Start interviewing other CTOs at other startups and understand what their roles are and what they need to do. Build relationships with them so that you have a network of advis…
My boss is a very experienced guy, he founded many companies and he is basically wanting to "test" me. At least that is what he says, but I definitely think he has what it takes to steer the ship correctly. We are currently being incubated, and all our mentors are very successful entrepreneurs and just by asking them the same question I posted here, I already learnt a lot . How would I survive? A loan maybe? I can su…
>> My boss is a very experienced guy, he founded many companies
He is experienced in what? In ripping of the interns? He as a "very experienced guy" is not able to get a loan of 6k and to pay you 1k monthly in cash until the company gets founded or dies? He wants to test you? Yeah, he wants to see whether you are ready to work for free!
Come on, that must be a joke!
Re: Ask HN: Should I accept a CTO position without much experience?
#28While you may be young, you're smart. You already noticed that there's an issue with your lack of experience. The question is: How do you solve that issue? Your success as CTO is mostly determined by yourself. Understand what's required of you. Start interviewing other CTOs at other startups and understand what their roles are and what they need to do. Build relationships with them so that you have a network of advis…
My boss is a very experienced guy, he founded many companies and he is basically wanting to "test" me. At least that is what he says, but I definitely think he has what it takes to steer the ship correctly. We are currently being incubated, and all our mentors are very successful entrepreneurs and just by asking them the same question I posted here, I already learnt a lot . How would I survive? A loan maybe? I can su…
There are lots of successful entrepreneurs in the world. Very few of them have success building startups in the sense that Silicon Valley uses the word. Much of what passes for a startup these days is a new small business and successful small business entrepreneurs often bring successful small business practices such as not paying employees for hours worked to their mentoring advice.
Would you take out a loan to work at a hotel or dry cleaners or construction company? That this is even on the table shows how disinterested people in a form of mutual success that includes you.
My experience is that before people screw me, they display tells. An unwillingness to pay is the most obvious. Take the CTO position without salary and it will be easy for people to rationalize not paying you based on your already having accepted not being paid. If your internship was also unpaid, that's probably the reason that the unpaid CTO position is being floated.
It's not any better if your internship was paid. An upaid CTO position then signals a willingness to take a pay cut and call it a promotion.
Re: Ask HN: Should I accept a CTO position without much experience?
#29While you may be young, you're smart. You already noticed that there's an issue with your lack of experience. The question is: How do you solve that issue? Your success as CTO is mostly determined by yourself. Understand what's required of you. Start interviewing other CTOs at other startups and understand what their roles are and what they need to do. Build relationships with them so that you have a network of advis…
My boss is a very experienced guy, he founded many companies and he is basically wanting to "test" me. At least that is what he says, but I definitely think he has what it takes to steer the ship correctly. We are currently being incubated, and all our mentors are very successful entrepreneurs and just by asking them the same question I posted here, I already learnt a lot . How would I survive? A loan maybe? I can su…
[deleted]
Re: Ask HN: Should I accept a CTO position without much experience?
#30I apologize if the following comes off as harsh, but it comes from experience, not malice. Where can I find people like you who will work for free on the promise of future money dependent on a roll of the die which is funding? Please tell me. I'll take one CTO, 2 senior devs, and 4 junior devs. Here's the deal. I don't know your situation, but you are basically saying that your time is worth $0. That might be true or…
I concur with that advice, it seems that the startup founders are looking for a naive young guy to work for free before getting some funding. If you (OP) are really interested in that position and trust the founders (I wouldn't, but I haven't met them in person, so who knows?), then you should become a co-founder and ask for significant amount of equity in the company (10% at least).