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Dell Computers Has Been Hacked

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Re: Dell Computers Has Been Hacked

#201

Post by spoondan »

hackuser wrote: post #200

Something doesn't make sense: How can it be worthwhile for the attackers to invest that much time in gaining access to one computer? Given wrong numbers and that many people won't answer the phone, be near the computer, have time at that moment, or be willing to cooperate, and then add the time it takes to talk an end user through such a process, will they gain access to even one computer every 2 hours? How can that…

The purpose of the scam is not to gain access to computers. The purpose of the scam is to fleece unsuspecting Dell customers. The scammers gain the trust of their victim by using misappropriated Dell customer data. They charge exorbitant fees for unnecessary services to the less technically competent.

My assumption is that the scammers are based in India or somewhere else where dollars go quite a bit farther than the US. Even apart from the potential for fraudulent charges, spending a few days to earn a few hundred dollars is definitely worth it in a country where the average income for a year is around $1300.

Re: Dell Computers Has Been Hacked

#202

Post by macintux »

xorcist wrote: post #180
macintux wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple has a data-driven business model?

Well, they aspire to. Their ad network is large and growing.

I've not seen numbers and I'm skeptical that it's growing, but the revenue can't be more than a rounding error on their books.

Lumping Apple with Google in terms of data gathering is misleading at best.

Re: Dell Computers Has Been Hacked

#203

Post by alextgordon »

geocar wrote: post #165
kruczek wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Programmers are not usually held accountable for their own bugs, and I think that needs to change too. I disagree. Bugs are created and will be created; it is up to the proper process to test the system and get rid of them. A bug that goes into production code is a collective failure. Why do you blame the programmer, but won't blame the tester, or the guy who designed the test, or the guy who designed whole workflo…

> Why do you blame the programmer, but won't blame the tester, or the guy who designed the test, or the guy who designed whole workflow, or the architect who planned the system? Where did you get the idea that I don't? I think people make mistakes sometimes (myself included), but I don't somehow think that diminishes the mistake. I also think the programmer has less responsibility than the architect, or the CTO (whic…

The best programmers have a choice of where they work, and will avoid environments that have a reputation for excessive blaming or scapegoating.

So it's a self-defeating strategy for a company to take. Only the desperate need apply.

Better to create an environment like the fabled NASA software lab, where individuals are never blamed -- only the "process". That will attract high-quality applicants.

Re: Dell Computers Has Been Hacked

#204

Post by nfoz »

cm2187 wrote: post #2

I don't know if it's related but I found something deeply worrying a couple of months ago. I purchased a laptop on Dell's website at my home address using a personal email and my personal paypal account. No reference anywhere to my job or employer. A couple of weeks later I receive a call from India on the mobile number provided to Dell, from a guy pretending to be from Dell (and he might have been) who wanted to dis…

I ordered a laptop from Dell, providing no information about my small employer. I ordered it from my own laptop but it was on my work's WiFi when I ordered it.

They called to confirm some BS about the order, and mentioned my employer's name. I was pretty stunned. I'm thinking they correlate IP address of your purchase on Dell.com with employer, I've heard such databases are available, but it's pretty surprising to me... not sure what else they do, except yeah, maybe googling their customers.

Re: Dell Computers Has Been Hacked

#205

Post by rikkus »

wuschel wrote: post #113
krick wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, I don't know how hard is it in the USA, but I use cash most of the time and know several people who do the same. Sure, sometimes you need to make wire transfer, or pay with credit card, or paypal for that matter. But at least shopping in the supermarket is possible with cash.

Then I do hope that you do not own a cashback etc bonus card, or your can be quite sure that your personal consumption related high resolution data will end up in some buyers pocket. And all that for a cheaper (and cheap) bread-knife.

In the UK we have a company called Boots which used to be a pharmaceutical giant and is now a high street toothpaste and moisturiser giant. At the counter, they always ask if I have a 'Boots card' (purchase tracking card). I say no, because I don't, and they are often confused - because it's weird to not only have presented one immediately, but to claim not to own one. I'm then told I can be given my 'points' on a receipt so that I can add them to my (non-existent) card later.

I'm not a tin foil hat type, but I really don't like filling my wallet with tracking cards and can't be bothered to claim the miniscule compensatory benefits provided in return for proffering my purchase (and also location, hygiene, etc.) information.

Saying 'no' is almost more hassle than simply submitting, however, which is probably exactly what the company would like to hear. Suggestions welcome for brushing off this nuisance without a) Avoiding their shops entirely (not practical) or b) Being rude to cashiers.

Re: Dell Computers Has Been Hacked

#206

Post by mastazi »

macintux wrote: post #202
xorcist wrote: post #180

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, they aspire to. Their ad network is large and growing.

I've not seen numbers and I'm skeptical that it's growing, but the revenue can't be more than a rounding error on their books. Lumping Apple with Google in terms of data gathering is misleading at best.

You mean Apple, the company that until recently forced you to give them cc data in order to install any app on your device, regardless of the app being a paid or free one?

Re: Dell Computers Has Been Hacked

#207

Post by JadeNB »

branchless wrote: post #160
JadeNB wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A serious question, though I assume that you were joking: is it more creepy to have your own actions tracked and accurately tied to you, or other people's actions tracked and inaccurately tied to you? Both sound pretty awful to me, but I think I'd prefer the former if those were the only two options.

What stops these guys from selling to all the major health insurers. Been buying too much sugar? Dental insurance up. Too much butter? Health insurance up. Bought three times the median amount of headache tablets? That's a paddlin'. Bought more alcohol than normal? Car insurance up. Opt out to keep off their radar? They assume the worst and charge you double?

> What stops these guys from selling to all the major health insurers.

Is this a response to my comment? I would guess that the answer is "nothing but the temporary protection of the law", but, assuming that protection is eventually revoked, it makes it all the more worrisome for me to have a random stranger's data taken as my own.

Re: Dell Computers Has Been Hacked

#208

Post by simonh »

kuschku wrote: post #192
simonh wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure but no country on earth, not even the USA, has anything close to a pure capitalist system in that sense. Furthermore Nordic Model countries vary, but are very much capitalist. From wikipedia: "Sweden's industry is overwhelmingly in private control; unlike some other industrialized Western countries, such as Austria, Italy or Finland, state owned enterprises were always of minor importance." In fact I think I can…

Yes. Every country is in some way "social", but social market economies focus strongly on keeping a balance. Especially in the US the balance has been skewed since forever towards capitalism. Historically, Social Market Economies evolved in countries where the population was supportive of socialist and communist uprisings, but the ruling class tried to keep the economy, and implemented the same benefits as in a socia…

What I'm arguing against us the implication that such 'social market' economies are in any way not capitalist or less capitalist than others. Its a false premse. Nordic model national economies can be very capitalism friendly or very statist.

Re: Dell Computers Has Been Hacked

#209

Post by janvidar »

kuschku wrote: post #105
Silhouette wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you find it complicated, then you should not use C, nor should you use it for things it's not intended for. In theory, string handling in C is straightforward enough. In practice, string handling in C is the source of a crazy number of security vulnerabilities and other bugs, even in popular and relatively well regarded software written by experts. No-one should still need to use C in 2016. We know how to fix many…

1 Word: Rust.

Maybe, but in the mean time we have C++.

Re: Dell Computers Has Been Hacked

#210

Post by davismwfl »

drzaiusapelord wrote: post #163
davismwfl wrote: post #132

I posted about this about 7 months ago on HN, https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9881674 , I also tweeted it out. Dell responded to my tweet saying there has been no breach and our data was secure. Obviously I didn't and don't believe them, and their main response was report it to the FTC. That is crap, admit it, fix it and deal with the issue. What totally pissed me off is that it was my sons laptop they called on…

I've accepted that we live in an age where no one can secure data that is coveted by determined attackers. Even companies with the best infosec are often taken down by the simplest social engineering or clumsy spear-phisihng attempts that work well enough. I hope this changes as we migrate away from passwords and passphrases to mandatory two factor login with physical keyfob tokens, from C to Rust, and from putting t…

I agree that there is no way to prevent the determined hacker or state actor from breaking into just about anything they want. Just like putting locks on our doors keeps the common criminal out for the most part, but the determined guy/gal will find his way in.

What always bothers me more is how caviler many companies, especially many marketing companies I have seen, are with our personal details. As recently as just a few years ago I was fixing one such marketing company's issues, like using sequential id's on exposed web links sent in emails. Which all you had to do was increment the id and you could get personal details for other people from the database (which had happened). They fixed that issue and some others but still never addressed security as a whole, which just bugged me. Plain text passwords in a database, no encryption on sensitive data etc. And I see it over and over, a company won't change unless they are forced to, and then it is change only enough to appear secure, not be secure.

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