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G.M. Invests $500M in Lyft

nytimes.com

31–40 of 402 posts

Re: G.M. Invests $500M in Lyft

#31

I don't know whether this is a real difference or not, but Lyft "feels" like a much nicer company than Uber. I'm not thrilled about Lyft's rampant hipster-branding, but Uber seems like a company run by pricks. Maybe it's just because they're the underdog, but I'm really rooting for Lyft.

> Uber seems like a company run by pricks

I recently interviewed with Uber in Asia, spoke to a half dozen people there right up to the head of the region and many Americans who have been with the company for years, and I did not get the job (so, clearly not biased towards the company).

Here's my one data point: they were all really nice, professional, competent people I'd actually want to work with. When I say nice, I don't mean polite, but trustworthy and well intentioned.

They are working very hard to cope with the massive growth of their app, trying to figure out how to manage 200 offices in parallel with tiny teams whilst keeping the same quality standards and avoiding unsavoury incidents that come when you hire a large number of people in many locations (imagine what would happen if there was a rape or robbery attempt by an Uber driver). They are under extreme press scrutiny and large amounts of negative PR globally, because they are hitting some of the best organised, most entrenched oligopolies.

Psychologically, it felt like there was a strong sense of family and purpose, that I haven't really seen since I left commodities trading (whose companies are family owned businesses where long careers are common). They were proud of what they were building, genuinely appreciating the value added to the community by their work. The place also felt meritocratic, with people getting expanded responsibility rapidly after proving themselves (based on the career path of the long timers I talked to - could be survivorship bias).

Naturally, I poked a bit towards the "unethical" side of things, suggesting a couple of things as feelers for how they would react. The reaction was overwhelmingly negative - it seems that "dirty tricks" are not looked well in Uber in 2015 at least, fair competition is the name of the game.

So, they impressed me enough as people (after impressing me as a service) that here I am putting up a positive word on HN. I suspect much of the negative press is "black" PR from competitors and threatened interest groups.

Re: G.M. Invests $500M in Lyft

#32
GM's current mktcap is about $53B. A $500m investment represents putting almost 1% of their company into Lyft. Tesla's mktcap is about half of GM's, so this investment represents 2% of Tesla. Uber's last valuation put them above both GM and Ford, so what GM is looking at is a Lyft competitor "worth" more than they are and they want in.

I don't really care about talk of tech bubbles, but seeing older institutions invest so aggressively in startups is gnarly. Both Fidelity and Blackrock went into Uber and now GM owns a huge piece of Lyft.

I don't really have a point. Just thinking out loud because I'm not sure what to think...

Re: G.M. Invests $500M in Lyft

#33
post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To answer my own question after thinking for a couple minutes: maybe VW's fall will put it in a position for Uber to get in play.

Interesting point about VW: To my knowledge VW has no car sharing/CaaS service in Germany. Others are better setup if self driving cars take over: Opel (GM) has one, BMW has one (DriveNow), Daimler has one (Car2Go).

VW has Greenwheels (not really that common or popular though) and Quicar (only in Hannover)

Re: G.M. Invests $500M in Lyft

#35
post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The big difference for me is that Lyft allows you to tip in the app that's very telling.

Yes, it's very telling that Lyft offers a suboptimal experience.

Not being pressured to carry cash is a suboptimal experience?

I refuse to carry cash. If I were to take Uber, I'd have drivers one-starring me and giving me a bad reputation for not tipping them. With Lyft, I can tip in the app and avoid all that mess.

Re: G.M. Invests $500M in Lyft

#36
post #23

The "short-term car rental hubs... where people who do not own cars can pick up a vehicle and drive for Lyft to earn money" is a nice idea in the short-term. I still think Uber has the right idea long-term with a completely autonomous fleet, but once those hit the market, there will still be a pretty large demand for NON-autonomous vehicles -- take my parents, for instance, who refuse to get into a car not driven by…

Your parents will be irrelevant in 2 or 3 generations from now. At some point, fully autonomous will be a norm without the fear.

Hence he said "short term". 2-3 generation from now certainly isn't the short term

Re: G.M. Invests $500M in Lyft

#37
post #19
post #9

So Google+Ford, Lyft+GM, Tesla on both sides software/hardware... Where is Uber's Hardware going to come from now? I wonder if this is an instance where the personalities involved with Uber are having a detrimental effect on these sorts of long-term needs. Or is there something yet to be announced?

Didn't Uber buy the Carnegie Mellon robotics division? Is it too much to think they might try for their own hardware platform? It might be, but why else do so?

I thought they just made a deal with CMU and then proceeded to recruit everyone to leave.

Re: G.M. Invests $500M in Lyft

#38
post #9

So Google+Ford, Lyft+GM, Tesla on both sides software/hardware... Where is Uber's Hardware going to come from now? I wonder if this is an instance where the personalities involved with Uber are having a detrimental effect on these sorts of long-term needs. Or is there something yet to be announced?

You know that Google Ventures put $200m+ into Uber right?

Re: G.M. Invests $500M in Lyft

#39
post #19
post #9

So Google+Ford, Lyft+GM, Tesla on both sides software/hardware... Where is Uber's Hardware going to come from now? I wonder if this is an instance where the personalities involved with Uber are having a detrimental effect on these sorts of long-term needs. Or is there something yet to be announced?

Didn't Uber buy the Carnegie Mellon robotics division? Is it too much to think they might try for their own hardware platform? It might be, but why else do so?

They will still need a chassis/engine before they have a viable car, and there's been no real external indication of them either developing that in house or partnering with/purchasing someone that can provide that expertise.

.. at least I think that's what the question is about.

Re: G.M. Invests $500M in Lyft

#40
post #19
post #9

So Google+Ford, Lyft+GM, Tesla on both sides software/hardware... Where is Uber's Hardware going to come from now? I wonder if this is an instance where the personalities involved with Uber are having a detrimental effect on these sorts of long-term needs. Or is there something yet to be announced?

Didn't Uber buy the Carnegie Mellon robotics division? Is it too much to think they might try for their own hardware platform? It might be, but why else do so?

But they still need the actual vehicle hardware, chassis, motor, etc knowledge. CMU's robotics division is just provides the self-driving component.
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